Talk:The Legend of Zelda: The Wind Waker

Map Select
Within the res/Menu folder, there are two files. kanfont_fix16.bfn is the kanji font for the menu, and Menu1.dat which contains all the strings for the maps that are available on the menu. You can see the contents of the menu itself by opening Menu1.dat in something that can view Shift-JIS. I'm sure there are maps listed that aren't anywhere in the game. You can find these files in every version of Wind Waker, so maybe it's possible to get the Menu to show up again? I know that there are Action Replay codes for warping to any map you'd like, but map selects are much cooler. By the way, Twilight Princess doesn't have these two files anymore in any of the regular versions. If you find the store demo for the Wii version of Twilight Princess however (it's considered an "E3" build, which it isn't because it was compiled later I think), it actually has these two files on the DVD still. While the version in particular was picked clean of any unused maps (likewise, the final versions were picked clean of anything else either), the Menu1.dat mentions A LOT of maps, some going far back as E3 2005 where Twilight used to be black and white. You can check out the map select files from Wind Waker here (http://dl.dropbox.com/u/38216/windwaker%20map%20select%20files.zip). For Twilight Princess I'd have to dig it up again. Hope this was interesting. Evilhamwizard 13:17, 20 February 2011 (EST)
 * Here's a pastie of the contents of Menu1.dat, sorry if it looks messy. (http://pastie.org/1586471). You can look at the font file in tile molester by setting the codec to 4bpp linear and the mode to 2 Dimensional. Also for fun, here are the TP Wii 'e3' demo's Map Select files (http://dl.getdropbox.com/u/38216/Menu.zip). And here's a pastebin of the contents of that as well (warning it's big) (http://pastebin.com/5TT9J7Sj). Evilhamwizard 13:43, 20 February 2011 (EST)

Triangle Island Glitch(?)
ag6YusISIzk I found this on YouTube of what happens if you go out-of-bounds while on top of the Tower of Gods, but didn't know if it was worth putting in the article. -WarioBarker 21:37, 6 July 2011 (EDT)

Isn't this one of the early islands from the early island list on the wind waker page? I believe this island is under the group name "ADMumi" if I'm not mistaken (Seach for ADMumi on this page as well- http://www.zeldawiki.org/Hacks_in_The_Legend_of_Zelda:_The_Wind_Waker). I think you should at least post a link to this video on the wind waker page. This is not an island you can get to in normal gameplay and this video shows how to get there without hacking. Its worth putting in the article in my opinion. I mean the worst that can happen is that someone disagrees and takes the link down. -Cuber456 20:01, 6 July (EDT)


 * Looks very much like it: http://www.jaytheham.com/zc/wwbar.html#ti Note the three statues placed way too close to each other, etc. --Xdaniel 06:36, 7 July 2011 (EDT)

Baton Stone
Baton Stone texts ?



--Dark Linkaël 11:59, 25 July 2011 (EDT)

The Wind Waker game to search!
I noticed that yesterday or the day before yesterday, he began to be some new research on The Wind Waker, which pleased me very much! This Zelda contains a lot of things just waiting to be discovered. I encourage all the hackers to look into this game is a Zelda with the most unused content with Ocarina of Time. --Dark Linkaël 13:06, 8 August 2011 (EDT)

The causes of non-load some unused rooms.
A year ago that, I studied the files in "Stage.arc" some rooms The Wind Waker. I finally found the reason for not loading places like: E3ROOP, ENDumi, Msmoke, and others. It is located in a file named "stage.dzs". By another file of the same type instead of the original (the same size or equal), the problem of not loading the room is set. I tried some changes with a hex editor, but without success. I hope this detail may help resolve the issue peacefully and so the last visit of unused rooms The Wind Waker. --Dark Linkaël 05:51, 9 August 2011 (EDT)

2 DMAP
If you enlarge the map of the place "Cave08" you will see a map different from that which is smaller. From top to bottom, it is cried

2 DMAP

(Japanese)



--Dark Linkaël 10:49, 9 August 2011 (EDT)

The map actually says "2D MAP (Japanese text says "Dummy" (in katakana))". --From: divingkataetheweirdo 13:38, 9 August 2011 (EDT)

Debug Menu ?
There are some interesting lines of code showing a possible Debug Menu in the data of the game. Menu1.dat also part of this huge menu with several options.

Offset: 0037E8C0 (ISO) U.S version

I put the file "boot.dol" of the game right here if you want to research it and make Action Replay codes. 

Offset: 0035FCC0 (boot.dol) U.S Version

I note that the Debug Menu Super Smash Bros. Melee is also visible in the same way and he had these codes.

--Dark Linkaël 13:00, 13 August 2011 (EDT)

Sort of offtopic but IIRC, Treeki found some kind of debug function in WW a while back, I'll go bug him about it. --Oaa 23:55, 13 August 2011 (EDT)

After several checks, the location of "Debug Menu" (Menu1.dat) is just before that of the "File Selection". This therefore means that it must enable the "Debug Menu" just before the "File Selection". It will take an Action Replay code of the same type as that of Super Smash Bros. Melee that loads a different screen of the current.

In trying to reverse the "File Selection" by the "Debug Menu", the game freezes when loading the "File Selection". --Dark Linkaël 10:32, 17 August 2011 (EDT)

It's been a few days I'm working on finding the Debug Menu in The Wind Waker. Since yesterday, I know slightly more about the location of the hidden menu using the debugger of the emulator Dolphin. Contrary to what I said last time, the Debug Menu would be available just before the title screen or on the title screen.

1) "dScnLogo" is the title screen

(Create, Delete, Draw, Execute, IsDelete)

2) "dScnMenu" is the Debug Menu

(BMG, Create, Delete, Draw, Execute, IsDelete, tex)

3) "dScnName" is the screen "File Selection"

(Create, Delete, Draw, Execute, IsDelete)

"fopScnM" I suspect he is also a link with the Debug Menu.

However, I do not know if I need to change in this area. I stalled for the moment and I think I'll need help to see further research.

I put two images to show a little more detail.



--Dark Linkaël 08:49, 6 September 2011 (EDT)

It's interesting that if you run the debug menu (dScnMenu_Create__FP11scene_class) by replacing, say, the pointer to the logo routine with one to the debug menu, the debug function(s) actually all run fine, they load the level select file into memory and what not, and it's later on that something causes an error and crashes. Jhameleon 01:02, 7 September 2011 (EDT)

Please, could you tell us how to replace the pointer to the logo routine with one to the debug menu? We did not manage to do this, so far. Thank you very much!

PS: Please excuse Dark Linkaël's errors, as he's using a translator because I don't have the time to translate for him (and he's so pressed to discover something about the debug menu that he doesn't even ask me).

Link

--Dark Linkaël 06:39, 7 September 2011 (EDT)

I finally managed to make it work, but by another method! Just with codes. I have not tested the Debug menu, but I will do now.



--Dark Linkaël 10:08, 7 September 2011 (EDT)

The Debug Menu blocks for the simple reason that it is executed on startup of the game; I made a new code that is running the Debug menu on the "File Selection" screen and it works now!

Enjoy! --Dark Linkaël 11:29, 7 September 2011 (EDT)


 * Is it possible to port this code to other versions of WW? My version of the game is older than the version this code is intended for (my copydate is 03/02/19 11:43:53). :( Evilhamwizard 13:33, 7 September 2011 (EDT)


 * Small precision that I had forgotten. This code is made ​​from the European version. I ferris tomorrow for the US and Japanese version. --Dark Linkaël 13:36, 7 September 2011 (EDT)

Nice job!! I've ported the code to U and J versions, both are tested working :)

U

J

Jhameleon 18:09, 7 September 2011 (EDT)

Perfect for codes! Now all the hackers can take advantage of this great wonder.

A big thank you to Evilhamwizard for finding the existence of a Map Select how to OOT and MM and thank you for making me Jaytheham to further my research by citing a method, I was really about to give up!

I'll try to see if there are other debug functions in the game, as some texts seem rather strange. In Twilight Princess, I do not think there is still a Map Select because of the absence of Menu1.dat. Video games today have less access to the debug functions. Nintendo and others know that hackers are capable of all. --Dark Linkaël 06:06, 8 September 2011 (EDT)

The place Msmoke works in part by using the Debug Menu with the emulator Dolphin. He puts two error messages referring to the doors, then finally load. Only one of two rooms works. It is also possible to visit the place SubD51. A place to wash or hides a box of 100 Rupees. --Dark Linkaël 09:43, 8 September 2011 (EDT)

The code works nicely :). The only thing I would wish for now is to translate the debug menu into English since I have no idea how the menu operates. I think something similar(a hack) was done to the debug menu in OoT. Cuber456 15:43, 8 September 2011 (EDT)

It may be possible by modifying the "kanfont_fix16.bfn" and back into the game with programs like "GCR v1.0" for example. The only thing is that the file must have the same size as the original. --Dark Linkaël 06:22, 9 September 2011 (EDT)

It's really simple actually, I'm doing it now http://www.jaytheham.com/img/GZLE01-1.png Jhameleon 07:17, 9 September 2011 (EDT)

Very nice work, it is well presented! In the same way as OOT and MM. What is the method to be done? --Dark Linkaël 07:37, 9 September 2011 (EDT)

You replace the SHIFT_JIS text with standard english in a hex editor, I used GlitterBerrie's translations from the forum thread. http://www.jaytheham.com/Menu1.dat Just replace your Menu1.dat with this one to translate all the area names. The other text is in the .dol. Jhameleon 09:11, 9 September 2011 (EDT)

Finally, the other file that needed to be changed.

It works well for the PAL version. Logic as it is a file not changed for all versions and they all have the same size. --Dark Linkaël 10:49, 9 September 2011 (EDT)

Actually, they did leave a Menu1.dat and font file for Twilight Princess, but only in the "E3 Demo". It lists a TON of unused maps, even some marked specifically for E3 2005. But the only problem is that they really purged the game for unused map files (they only left one in there, I think), and they purged even more from the "E3 Demo" build of the game. Also, I doubt they left any other (useful) debug things in Wind Waker because they marked the builds with "NDEBUG", which indicated that debugging of the game was completed at this point of development. So they probably did the same thing as they did with OoT/MM, just left the Map Select but removed everything else. :\ Evilhamwizard 11:44, 9 September 2011 (EDT)

In 2006, Nintendo was already everything to prevent hackers to dig into the data of a game. The E3 2006 demo escapes to the rule and more!

I think that there are still debug functions in TWW. Take example of SSBM, it has incredible debug mode, which is not the case for SSBB is very recent.

To return to the Debug menu TWW, I wonder why the Controller 3 does not work and is always OFF. --Dark Linkaël 12:11, 9 September 2011 (EDT)

There is already a time of it, I found a way to change the OFF to ON, simply load the Debug Menu in the game, passing a door for example. However, you must activate the code only once the savegame loaded. It is also advisable to use the Dolphin emulator only. Does not work on GameCube and Wii.

US :

EUR :

The effects of Controller 3 in ON seem to do anything special... --Dark Linkaël 07:37, 2 December 2011 (EST)

If the list and some texts present on the Debug Menu is translated, the translation is missing from the list of times of day (day and night). Here is a picture of the full list:



--Dark Linkaël 08:06, 27 December 2011 (EST)

Just curious - is there an Action Replay equivalent of the Debug code? --Aoi 00:30, 27 January 2012 (EST)

I do not understand your question. Can you clarify the question, please?

--Dark Linkaël 06:31, 27 January 2012 (EST)

It seems that the text "３コン（A）：デモ２３ OFF" is for "demo 23" of the game would be an option to make this playable demo.

I found it in the file "framework.map" :

00000a78 000055 803f7298 1 .sbss 	d_s_menu.o   00000a78 000004 803f7298  4 l_startID 	d_s_menu.o   00000a7c 000004 803f729c  4 l_cursolID 	d_s_menu.o   00000a80 000004 803f72a0  4 l_timepat 	d_s_menu.o   00000a84 000002 803f72a4  2 l_weekpat 	d_s_menu.o   00000a86 000002 803f72a6  2 l_demo23 	d_s_menu.o   00000a88 000004 803f72a8  4 l_groupPoint 	d_s_menu.o   00000a8c 000001 803f72ac  1 l_languageType 	d_s_menu.o

This does not preclude that it is strange that this option gives priority to a demo and not the others.

Of course, this is just an idea for now.

--Dark Linkaël 06:06, 14 February 2012 (EST)

Dark Linkaël, I have to ask, have you made progress trying to figure out what the "３コン（A）：デモ２３ OFF" option is? I don't know about you but if I turn this option on and load Demo 23 then the game just crashes on me. The fact that I can't seem to use this option during Demo 23 only makes me more interested kind of like A_R00 did.

--Cuber456 07:00, 27 March 2012 (EDT)

I do not really know what is the use of this option, but it is possible that she used to play for a cutscene of the game. For now, I can not say more on this subject, I still do not understand this strange option. But I'll try again in a few times.

--Dark Linkaël 13:22, 27 March 2012 (EDT)

Four arrows around Link
Yesterday, I found several videos of The Wind Waker is a hacker. One of them intrigues me a lot and I do not think I remember that in the game. It shows four red arrows around Link and seems to be activated by doing something special. This looks very much like something used in the Debug Mode of the game, at least I think!

--Dark Linkaël 07:11, 20 August 2011 (EDT)
 * I'm pretty sure that those arrows are the arrows for Wind Waker input. Looks like the hacker made it so that the game didn't stop when the Wind Waker was pulled out, leading to the arrows appearing around Link.

-Gamma 00:17, 21 January 2012 (EST)

Doors to the outside of Hyrule Castle


Around the Hyrule Castle, it is possible to see the doors and stairs. However, they are not really visible in the game. Do the doors that were used in an older version of The Wind Waker or simple decorations?

--Dark Linkaël 06:46, 22 August 2011 (EDT)
 * I doubt it. Look at the low-res textures and limited geometry; you clearly weren't meant to get close to those.
 * --Afti 09:14, 6 September 2011 (EDT)

I do not think it's a coincidence that these gates to Hyrule Castle. It is possible that there were several rooms, including outside.

The image below is certainly not a simple decoration.



There is a cave in the place off the top of Ganon's Tower, which is impossible to see in the game because of several things like the camera position and waterfalls.

--Dark Linkaël 12:33, 15 February 2012 (EST)

Tetra's crew out of bounds
Please, bare with me. This video ain't mine, and I hate it just as much as you do. The second you open it, mute it. http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=tdoiI9CAp0c&feature=related Go to 1:49. Look at that, Tetra's crew can be found out of bounds, and they can be talked to. Should this be added to the article? Preferably with good quality... {EspyoT} 19:11, 13 September 2011 (EDT)

A_R00(aka the forest from spaceworld 2001 trailer)
Here is something interesting. I found a video of someone who somehow transferred the collision data of room A_R00 to google sketchup. You can see parts of this room in this early trailer. He even provided a download link so you can view it yourselves in sketchup. I wish to know if this is something credible we can add to the main page. What do you guys think? I want your opinion. --Cuber456 18:15, 2 January 2012 (EDT)

Unlike other models of each room of the game, the A_R00 model is very different. However, it is possible to see this model with some software. This video is totally credible and interesting enough to be here. --Dark Linkaël 06:32, 3 January 2012 (EST)


 * So I guess I will add that video to the main page. I'm just curious, what software would you use to view the collision model? So far I can use GC-Tool to extract the files within A_R00 and use szstools to view the files within Room0.arc and Stage.arc. I believe the collision file is called room.dzb but I could be wrong. That is as far as I got and I don't know how to view the collisions. I know bmdview2 can view graphic models but I don't think it can view collision models. How did you view the collision model? --Cuber456 18:05, 3 January 2012 (EDT)

The file "room.dzb" propablement is the collision of a room.

There are software "Maya" for example, which is also quoted right here. Precisely, the BMD file of the room "A_R00" is directly made ​​from Maya software, its format is impossible to read with the software BMDView2.

With hex editor, it is possible to see the comparison of a normal BMD file and "A_R00".

The beginning of a classic BMD file looks like this:

'''J3D2bmd3... ....SVR3............INF1...`........'''

And the beginning of BMD file of the room "A_R00" looks like this:

...map        test_R00_siroroom...project     projectMapTool...generator   Maya...user        DummyUser...version     1.31...date..2002/07/19...time..15:20...num_define.2...define_tag.GroupDefine...define_tag.PolygonDefine..

It's very different!

--Dark Linkaël 06:32, 4 January 2012 (EST)
 * Re: .dzb files: Here's a .dzb, .dzr and (partial) .bmd viewer I wrote, the .dzb portion being based on initial documentation by Twili. .dzb's are collision and related data, while .dzr's are room-specific actor definitions, path waypoints, etc., etc. There's a rather long WW hacking thread at  with some more documentation and such, although I think you have to be logged in to view it. --Xdaniel 10:02, 4 January 2012 (EST)

It's a bit what I thought files "dzb" and "dzr".

However, there is a file that interests me a lot and that is in the file "stage.arc". Inside, there is a file named "stage.dzs" and very often responsible for freezing of certain rooms, such as E3ROOP and many others. I talk about this subject on this page.

The file "dzs" to A_R00 is very small... --Dark Linkaël 10:41, 4 January 2012 (EST)

I don't know if it's relevant, but this youtube user loaded the collision data for the map in-game. Just wanted to bring it up in case no one's tried or knew about it or something.

--Celice 02:17, 18 January 2012 (EST)

Some Japanese Text and Japanese Logo in the US version
I was able to find some Japanese text relating to button actions in the US version of the game which is obviously unused. I also found the Japanese logo for the game within the US version as well. I know that this isn't really surprising but it is worth adding right? I would probably want to have a distinct note that I am talking about the US version strictly. --Cuber456 21:30, 19 January 2012 (EST)
 * I'd say no. They're just leftover scraps of the translation process and, quite frankly, aren't all that interesting. --BMF54123 22:28, 19 January 2012 (EST)

E3 Chandelier? And Other Misc. Stuff
I posted this on my thread, but I suppose I could post it here, too. I found the chandelier that Link jumps onto at the end of the first E3 trailer:

http://i44.tinypic.com/517bn.png

It has two animations- a 'Swinging' one and 'Tilted' one. I'll probably make a video of both later.

Also, there's the matter of the Jabun dummy, seen in the video to the right.

arUqNSZGeLc

Should I just add it to the 'Unused Models' section? Or can I make it a separate subject?

One more thing... Before, Room19 of Siren wouldn't load. I found that this was because it's .dzr (file that includes actors) didn't have a PLYR section for some reason, meaning that Link couldn't spawn, thus breaking the room. By a little hex editing (and some help from XDaniel) I was able to get it working:

http://i54.tinypic.com/2nasn07.png

http://i54.tinypic.com/15w0gg.png

These photos were taken a while ago; I'd like to take some better ones (maybe I can reduce the green-ness of it), but unfortunately I didn't save the edited file. I'll add that to my list.

-Gamma 00:36, 21 January 2012 (EST)


 * That chandelier does look like it came from the E3/spaceworld trailer. I would assume that it is unused in the final game simply because it is all the same color and looks rather bland. That being said though, even though I don't remember seeing this in the final game, I could have overlooked it.


 * As for the Jabun dummy model, I am assuming that this model isn't used for the figurine. I say you add it however you want to. If you feel like you could write a decent amount and use that video you have, then give it it's own section. Otherwise combine it with the other models.

-Cuber456 3:00, 21 January 2012 (EST)


 * I searched in most rooms of the game and I do not see anywhere this chandelier. It is an object not used in the final game.


 * About Jabun... In The Wind Waker, the water is not transparent and therefore impossible to see in detail a character swimming. It is also the same for Link. The only way to see it fully, it is in a test rooms, where there is water completely transparent.


 * TWW_LinkSwim.png

--Dark Linkaël 06:45, 21 January 2012 (EST)


 * Response to Gamma: I just saw on this page, a link to a video with sound can be unused in the game


 * For Jabun (Jaboo.aw), I have never heard these sounds there. They are not used to me.


 * For (Shiren.aw), it is the voice of Gohdan accelerated x2. The normal voice is that of a woman speaking (Japanese?).

--Dark Linkaël 08:18, 21 January 2012 (EST)


 * Ah, I see. The method I used to dump the sounds must have sped them instead of slowed them down.


 * On another note, I will give the dummy its own section.


 * Found this image in the arc called 'title.' It's not the logo used on the title screen, because those are in Tlogo and TlogoE. This arc also has a negative-looking 'vrbox' and a duplicate of the island in vrtest (complete with the ocean, too). Wonder what this could have been for?

Logo: http://i42.tinypic.com/jfixbk.png

'vrbox:' http://i52.tinypic.com/351ttlk.jpg

Copy of vrtest: http://i52.tinypic.com/2r7q2ae.jpg

-Gamma 09:41, 21 January 2012 (EST)


 * I know it well, and I ask myself a lot of questions above. It is possible that this is the title screen a demo of the game of E3 2002 maybe? Or, just a test of the title screen.

--Dark Linkaël 11:59, 21 January 2012 (EST)


 * Looks like the Japanese logo from the "title" arc was used in Japanese promo material - at the very least in commercials and on the game's website: see http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=OACFaDZYVlc and http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=m5pv7yRNiI8 as well as http://www.nintendo.co.jp/ngc/gzlj/index.html --Xdaniel 12:21, 21 January 2012 (EST)


 * I found that Japanese logo as well. I mentioned it earlier on the talk page. Besides it being unused in the US version, I assumed it was the standard Japanese logo. I don't know what the actual Japanese logo looks like in the Japanese version of the Wind Waker.

--Cuber456 21:23, 21 January 2012 (EST)


 * It's not the logo that surprises me the most, but the model VrTest. It is in the data models and not in the data rooms. I still feel that this is only a test for the title screen.

--Dark Linkaël 06:38, 22 January 2012 (EST)

Hey, can anyone confirm if it's possible to get this message normally? I got it when I tried saving from a location chosen with the debug menu.

http://i43.tinypic.com/swv4fa.png

-Gamma 21:10, 23 January 2012 (EST)


 * Yes. Load the game normally from your memory card, then once the game's fully loaded, switch your memory card to a different memory card, with a different set of Wind Waker saves, and try to save.  I didn't try it with a card that didn't have a Wind Waker save on it - the only card I have without a WW save on it (third of three cards) is one of those tiny GameCube cards, already full of other save junk. --Aoi 00:12, 24 January 2012 (EST)

My latest discovery from yesterday evening. With the Debug menu, I entered the room of the mini-boss Mohtula. There, I see the treasure chest "Boomerang" is a circle of a few rupees green. Have you ever seen those rupees?



If these do not exist rupees, it could be an alternative unused in this room. You can see some in rooms test for example.

--Dark Linkaël 06:26, 27 January 2012 (EST)

Unfortunately, I think that those rupees exist in that room. Go to about 7:15 on this video.

--Cuber456 16:10, 27 January 2012 (EST)

It's strange... I saw three different videos and I see no green rupees around the treasure chest. If this is not something unused, it is very strange about it. I would like to understand why the reason for this alternation.

--Dark Linkaël 17:01, 27 January 2012 (EST)

Can you post a link to one of the videos? I just checked the US version by using the debug menu. That chest in the US version has those green rupees around it. It might be a version difference possibly.

--Cuber456 18:04, 27 January 2012 (EST)

You know, I've been thinking... ENDumi has the pirate ship and the collision for one of the Triangle Islands in it, probably a placeholder. Going by its name and the presence of both the Pirate Ship and Aryll, could this have been the map they used to record the .thp played at the end of the game? Or, better yet, a remnant from when they were going to render the ending sequence in real time instead of as a prerecorded video?

-Gamma 23:07, 27 January 2012 (EST)

I still watched videos and I see both versions, what is even more mysterious. However, it is not version JP/US/EU is very different. I thought of the Day and Night, but that's not it either...

ENDumi and ADMumi are not unused rooms, but rooms simply to make the cut-scenes. ENDumi is the end of the game and ADMumi is that the three statues showing the Tower of the Gods. I can see the names of the rooms in the file "Menu1.dat".

--Dark Linkaël 05:44, 28 January 2012 (EST)

Alright.

So, while looking around, I've discovered that two textures from the old Siren rooms were actually used. The flowery design (the one called Hmon01) and the gold tile (H bz01) are reused; Hmon is on the ceiling in the upper floor of the Auction House and Hbz is in the lower room with the teleport one the ceiling. In that room, they use shading to make the ceiling black- the texture is a bit difficult to see, and might only be possible to see through BMDViewer. I'll have to take some screenshots later.

It's also come to my attention that the blue wall texture in Siren was actually reused in the final Tower- only, a 'dusty' effect was added over it and they toned down the blue. I'll have to take some screens of that, as well, to see if you guys agree. -Gamma 12:05, 4 February 2012 (EST)

Strangely, this door does not seem visible during the fight against Ganondorf. I've looked and I saw nothing.



Has anyone ever seen this?

--Dark Linkaël 13:05, 15 February 2012 (EST)

I've never seen a doorway there. In the final battle, the field is normally flat and no such doorway exists. How did you get it to appear?

--Cuber456 16:13, 15 February 2012 (EST)

Use the Debug Menu, then go to the room from the top of the Ganon's Tower. Then use the code "Moon Jump" and flies as high as possible without moving. Link will at some point face the magical barrier, then tries to fly to leave the area of the tower and falling into the void.

The thing to do, it is necessary that Link falls into the void in this area.

--Dark Linkaël 17:19, 15 February 2012 (EST)

I'd like to contest something on the page. It mentions 'two unused items called longsword and spear.' The images of the enemy weapons are missing two things- the Moblin's spear and the Darknut's sword. I'd bet that in all likelihood the two bokostick icons were placeholders until they finished the icons for those weapons- not that they're dumped Link weapons. Can we reword that to get rid of that inference?

-Gamma 14:57, 24 February 2012 (EST)

Orca and Sturgeon's house
I seem to remember someone figuring out that the warps for Orca and Sturgeons house were swapped with each other before release. It might be in the alternate Outset Island map.

Unused ChuChu model and animation?
I was hoping to confirm whether or not this model of the enemy chuchu is unused or not.



It is in directory Object\Cc\bdlm\cc_beta.bdl and appears to have one animation associated with it in the directory Object\Cc\bck\cc_beta.bck. Can I get confirmation if this is unused or not? --Cuber456 00:43, 22 January 2012 (EST)


 * I actually looked at that a while ago. I wasn't sure if it was actually unused, so I didn't mention it. It looks to me like the chuchu when it first spawns (between not being there and being just the base). I think more research is needed.

-Gamma 01:54, 22 January 2012 (EST)


 * I agree that more research is needed. I was trying to observe if this model pops up like you said when they first appear. I didn't really see that particular model unless I am being slow(possible :P) or perhaps I need to fight the enemy elsewhere. I was trying this on Outset Island at night and the debug testing room. Perhaps the purple chuchu uses it because it is different then other chuchus? I'm also trying to remember if chuchus hang on the ceiling in this game like they do in Twilight Princess. If they do then perhaps this is slime being dropped from the ceiling? I don't know... I'm just trying to suggest a plausible way we might be able to see this model in game.

--Cuber456 05:18, 22 January 2012 (EST)


 * I can not know if it is used or not, but I think that this is not something unused. I'm not sure we'll know more on it.

--Dark Linkaël 06:30, 22 January 2012 (EST)

Try smashing one with the big hammer maybe? --Oaa 09:28, 22 January 2012 (EST)

That's it! I confirm!

--Dark Linkaël 10:37, 22 January 2012 (EST)

Files JP/US/EU to "framework.map"
I shall make the file "framework.map" each version of The Wind Waker. I recall that it is through this file that I could discover the Debug Menu. It is possible that there are other interesting stuff to discover it.

JP Version -  US Version  -  EU Version

--Dark Linkaël 07:37, 24 January 2012 (EST)

Debug Console
Yesterday, I saw that activate the Debug Console on the Debug menu, there are texts with the buttons appear at the bottom of the screen. Apparently, the Debug Console can be used with a joystick.

Press X+Y+START to CLEAR console.

3DStick UP/Down to scroll.

Press A to output terminal from console.

SCROLL.F%3d %3d %3d Output=%1x.

Press L+R trigger to control console.

Press [Z] trigger to close this window.

Here is a picture as an example:



I have not seen it elsewhere in the game and I find it strange...

--Dark Linkaël 15:09, 25 January 2012 (EST)


 * Can you please provide us with a method/AR Code to access it?

-Gamma 13:33, 28 January 2012 (EST)


 * Convert the codes "Debug Menu" in Action Replay? Yes, I can do, but I have not really tested. I will try to do tomorrow.

--Dark Linkaël 16:40, 28 January 2012 (EST)


 * That's it! I hope they are good, I'm waiting a confirmation from you.

Debug Menu (JP)

A41V-1FXC-HHZB4

J1W3-W41N-6KC52

Debug Menu (US)

KBA8-T2CW-R9KW3

WVJ7-UQNJ-MEG5C

Debug Menu (EU)

T3WK-AWEY-94D1F

TNTC-Z8N1-RTG10

Debug Console (US)

PWJ6-810A-VZA46

HNB4-PWW0-ZEMU7

Q7YH-PACY-D36Q8

Debug Console (EU)

MV2U-P4EQ-29F0R

J7TG-HT8Z-AFTUR

Q7YH-PACY-D36Q8


 * Warning, these codes are perhaps not good!

--Dark Linkaël 06:25, 29 January 2012 (EST)

The US code gets the screen to come up, but it flickers a lot. I can't really read anything because of that. -Gamma 14:09, 29 January 2012 (EST)

Sorry, had a long and busy weekend, or I would have replied earlier, above. Yeah, that's what I'd meant - I was asking if there was possibly an Action Replay version of the Debug Menu codes, as I'm only running Wind Waker on my GameCube. :| I'll test the codes, too, and see how they behave on the Cube. --Aoi 14:47, 29 January 2012 (EST)

It is normal that it flickers in the Debug Console.

--Dark Linkaël 15:07, 29 January 2012 (EST)

My Action Replay won't accept the codes. For both the Debug Menu and Debug Console codes, it gives me a "Code is for a different game" error. --Aoi 15:12, 29 January 2012 (EST)

I just made the code for NTSC JP version of the game and even a surprise by using the Debug Console on the Debug Menu! This time, there's something new on the right side of the list. However, these texts are part of the Debug Menu and not the Debug Console.



Only visible on the Japanese version!

--Dark Linkaël 07:16, 1 March 2012 (EST)

Last night I watched a bit on the web if I could not find some hackers referring to the Debug Menu (Map Select) The Wind Waker. Forum of GSCentral, I found very interesting recent codes, which for the Debug Menu and Debug Console. Debug Menu code is different from mine, but it works the same way. As for that of the Debug Console, it is different and above all, it is usable!

http://board.gscentral.org/retro-hacking/

The Debug Console of Twilight Princess is also present! I will put the new code on the site TCRF, so that some can use it and see some interesting stuff.

Note that the codes JP/US/EU are the same.

Control Keys Press Z to open and close console window. Hold L+R and press A to enable debug output to console window. Hold L+R and press Stick Up/Down to scroll debug output up and down. Hold L+R and press X+START or Y+START to clear console window. Hold L+R and press X+Stick Left/Right to move console window left and right. Hold L+R and press Y+Stick Up/Down to move console window up and down. Press DPad Left/Up/Right to switch through debug pages.

--Dark Linkaël 08:57, 6 March 2012 (EST)

About the demo of TWW...
I have only the demo European of TWW, but I think it is the same as the other two versions. What I can say is that there are differences in. First, no Debug Menu, as Menu1.dat is not available. Strange, because the file is present in the final version. Second, it lacks at least 50 rooms.

Hyroom Hyrule I_TestM I_TestR ITest61 ITest62 ITest63 K_Test2 K_Test3 K_Test4 K_Test5 K_Test6 K_Test8 K_Test9 K_TestA K_TestB K_TestC K_TestD K_TestE KATA_HB KATA_RM Kazan Kaze KazeB KazeMB Kenroom M_Dai M_DaiB M_DaiMB Mukao Siren SirenB SirenMB TEST TF_01 TF_02 TF_05 TF_07 VrTest XBoss0 XBoss1 XBoss2 XBoss3

--Dark Linkaël 08:54, 28 January 2012 (EST)


 * Whe you talk about the demo of TWW, I assume you mean the demo that was on the Collector's Edition. If that is what you mean then I wouldn't be too surprised that the demo is missing so many rooms. Compare the release dates of the demo version of TWW to the final version. The last territory to get the final retail version of the game was Australia and that was on May 7, 2003. The earliest territory to see the Collector's Edition with that demo was Japan on November 7, 2003. It seems that during that in-between time they were mainly cleaning up unnecessary rooms for the demo. The main reason for this was probably to make the demo smaller so it could fit with the other games on the disk. Obviously test/debug rooms would never be seen so those would be scrapped. Since it is also a 20 minute demo, most areas past the dungeon on Dragon Roost Island would also be a waste of space. I wish there was an E3 demo of this game floating around somewhere...

--Cuber456 15:30, 28 January 2012 (EST)


 * I understand for the lack of rooms, but for the Debug menu is much stranger. In the file "framework.map" there dScnMenu_Method well that I use to activate the Debug Menu with codes, but no file Menu1.dat to view the screen. Twilight Princess and the demo at E3 2006 no longer has "dScnMenu_Method". In a very voluntary on the part of Nintendo.


 * It's a dream for me to have the demo from E3 2002 of The Wind Waker. I hope to see one day. There are a lot of stuff to discover. As the coveted prototype Zelda 64 (1996) which is my absolute obsession!

--Dark Linkaël 16:54, 28 January 2012 (EST)

This page needs to be corrected
What is with the to do at the top of the page? What needs to be corrected on the page?--Cuber456 22:46, 11 February 2012 (EST)

It's me, because my English is made directly from a translator and there are certainly many errors.

--Dark Linkaël 06:05, 12 February 2012 (EST)

Oh ok. I thought you meant that there was false data on the main page.--Cuber456 15:10, 13 February 2012 (EST)

It's just for the mistakes that I can write and because I see no one correct my writing, I preferred warn. This is also valid for other games where I added stuff.

It is better that the content of the site is clean and with the least amount of mistakes.

--Dark Linkaël 05:56, 14 February 2012 (EST)


 * I've been rewording everything a bit and fixing up the grammar. I hope no one's offended by my changes.

-Gamma 07:23, 16 February 2012 (EST)

No, I'm very happy and it's normal to make the correction.

--Dark Linkaël 07:27, 16 February 2012 (EST)

How could anyone be offended? It's makes the materials on the page more readable when other people edit wording and fix grammar. I'm happy when people do that. Besides, whenever you submit something, TCRF says "If you do not want your writing to be edited mercilessly and redistributed at will, then do not submit it here".

--Cuber456 23:33, 16 February 2012 (EST)

Unused(?) Maggie Animation
I think I found an unused Maggie animation when she was poor. Her model and animations are located in root\res\Object\Pm. The animation in question is in the bck folder under the name talk01.bck. You never talk to the poor version of Maggie in the game. Even if you talk to her in one of the test rooms, she doesn't display this animation(at least from what I remember). I think the other 2 animations are used. find.bck is used in one of the cut scenes where Link tries to save his sister. wait01.bck is used in one of the test rooms I think but I can't remember if it is used anywhere else. Can anyone confirm this information?--Cuber456 15:49, 13 February 2012 (EST)


 * Yeah, I think you've stumbled onto something here. Both of the cut-scenes that involved her 'poor' outfit have the animations within their .arcs (Demo_07 and Demo_23). It's interesting to note that Mila also has a pre-Forsaken Fortress object; though, hers only has a 'wait' animation. So, I'd be willing to bet that these do go unused. I'll go take a look at the cut-scenes again, though.


 * Yeah; they use the animations provided in the .arcs for both cut-scenes. So, this is a pretty nice find! I'll see if I can get Maggie to use that animation.-Gamma 23:17, 13 February 2012 (EST)


 * This is unused! Maggie does not speak in version "poor" and I've never seen this animation in the game


 * To add on TCRF!

--Dark Linkaël 05:51, 14 February 2012 (EST)


 * Good to know that this is confirmed to be unused! I need to take care of a few things first but I'll add this info and a video of the animation to the main page within a day or so. I'll probably put this info in its own section under the Jabun Dummy Model section.--Cuber456 21:15, 14 February 2012 (EST)

Ideas to make A_R00 a playable map
I don't know about you guys but one of the most interesting maps in my opinion has to be A_R00. This is simply because this map was shown in the first WW trailer. Of course, as the map is now, it is unplayable since it really doesn't have a proper model file. I assume that whatever proper model file that was originally there for the 2001 trailer is long gone and it doesn't exist on the final version of the game unless the model got misplaced somewhere else on the disk. This is kind of what happened to A_nami. However, I'm not hopeful that this model exists anymore(wouldn't someone have found it by now after 10 years??).

Now here is my idea to make this map playable again. I don't know how feasible it is but let's see how far we can take it. Is there be a way to convert a .3ds file back into a .bmd file? I say this because there is a download link on this video to download the collision data and view it in Google Sketchup. There is apparently a way to convert the file format of google sketchup(.skp) to .3ds here. If a .3ds file could be converted into a .bmd file then we could replace the current model file in A_R00 with this new one and perhaps this map might be completely playable. I know that the collision data acting as the model data might not look pretty but as long as the map loads and can be explored within the game, that's all I care about. What do you guys think? Is this feasible?

--Cuber456 05:41, 22 February 2012 (EST)

This is already playable by putting a model BMD size lower. Example, the model of the room "TEST", there is a video on it.

By cons, the method is that you cite to me impossible. The reason? BMD format is made ​​by Nintendo itself. A_R00 model is outdated due to a different format that the game refuses to execute. However, an editor BMD might help a new model of A_R00, but the textures are dead long ago...

--Dark Linkaël 07:07, 22 February 2012 (EST)

Well... I was able to create a model from the collision file. It wasn't too difficult but it took me a while to figure out because it wasn't a straight forward process.





I would like to import it into the game but, of course, that would be too easy. I tried to replace the old model file in A_R00 but I couldn't import it into the game because it is bigger than the old model originally was. Heck, I can't even tell if it is to scale with the original collision file. I need to figure out what size this needs to be. I hope I can get this old map to work again. I would be so happy.

--Cuber456 07:33, 25 February 2012 (EST)

Nice work!

Do what you can put the model in another room having a size greater? I think a place like Hyrule can be replaced.

--Dark Linkaël 08:03, 25 February 2012 (EST)



I do not know this room and it is not visible in the trailer of SW 2001. This room comes from the file "model.bmd"? I thought it was the same model as the forest.

--Dark Linkaël 15:38, 25 February 2012 (EST)

As someone already mentioned on the main page after you uploaded it, it looks to be an old version of the inside of Hyrule Castle. I wonder if this is the oldest model in the game because of the file format. No other files have it's particular format. It might be worth mentioning this if it is true. I love how A_R00 is like a treasure chest of unused content!

As for the reconstructed forest model, there will be some trial and error trying to get it in the game. Every time I try to change something in the game and load the game, dophin gets pissed at me and refuses to load the game. I am using Gc-tool to load the new arc files in. If I replace an arc file with a smaller one, the program asks me if I want to change the old filesize to a newer one in TOC. I don't know if I should say yes or no to it. I'm going to have to do this in steps to get this right. I should try to replace the collision file in hyrule with the one in A_R00 first. Then replace the dzr file in hyrule with the one in A_R00. The model should be the last thing to get replaced and like I mentioned before, I have no idea if it is the appropriate size. This will take some time to get right.

--Cuber456 22:43, 25 February 2012 (EST)

Hey, can you let me have a copy of the forest's new BMD? I might be able to get it to work.

-Gamma 23:58, 25 February 2012 (EST)

While I'd like to get this to work myself, it will probably be a while before I get it to work because my main priority right now is school. It would probably be better(and quicker) if I let you guys try to make it work. And so I present to you the model file

http://www.mediafire.com/?kb118fq52y1i9sf

Here are a few facts/notes that you should know that will help:


 * As a model file, it is pretty big. (From what I could do,) You can't place it in the A_R00 group file because of this. I tried to replace the old model file in that group with this one but GC-tool refused to replace the old arc because the new arc was bigger than the old one. Dark Linkaël suggested using the map group for Hyrule. The Hyrule arc is bigger than the new one so GC-tool should allow the arc file to replace the old Hyrule one. As whether dolphin will be stubborn and refuse to run it is a different story.....
 * As I mentioned earlier, I have no idea if this map is to scale or not. So if you are able to get this model running in the game, who knows if it will be properly displayed and match up to the collision.
 * If you look in the model file, by one of the hollow wood cylinders(not the tree trunks), there is a model of Link placed next to it. This wasn't part of the original collision. I added the Link model to get an idea for scaling. I was trying to match the scaling to the original trailer.

That's about it. If you are able to get this model to load in game let me know what you did to do so. I can guarantee that I will probably have to remake the model again so that it matches with the collision. Good luck and keep me updated!

--Cuber456 01:02, 26 February 2012 (EST)

I just watched with "Wind Viewer". There is a problem, or even a huge problem! The model "BMD" does not absolutely fits with the collision model "DZB". Although the size of the model looks quite good, it is the interlocking with the collision with wrong. It should be the model "BMD" unite with the "DZB" and "DZR", otherwise it is useless to have done a good job.

Ah yes, the model for the castle, it is the Hyrule Castle with less detail. Besides, how it takes to convert the file? With Maya or other software?

Otherwise, I think it is a model of preparation and not converted into format "BMD". We do not have software to create models "BMD" and the only Nintendo has. This is not a story of an older format.

--Dark Linkaël 06:12, 26 February 2012 (EST)

I'm pessimistic... I did various tests on a few different places with a very large size and it does not work... I usually always end up finding a way to see, but there... This model BMD does not seem supported by the game and I do not really know why. This is another huge problem, much more!

--Dark Linkaël 07:03, 26 February 2012 (EST)

This wouldn't happen to be the first problem you mention, would it? :P



So yes it doesn't match up quite yet. While it is a problem, it isn't impossible to fix. It will probably take me a little time to fix this though. Now on the second problem, if we can't even get it to load in the game, we are screwed. Here is the plan. I took the model from K_Tes6, converted it to 3ds format and converted it back to bmd format(well really bdl format but I changed from .bdl to .bmd, it loads as both in bmdview2 anyway).

http://www.mediafire.com/?clcos7d1d6756ap

It won't line up with the collision but see if you can get this model to load in game. If it does, great. If it doesn't then I really don't know what to do.... Load the map from the debug menu. It is the first group on the list, it is called NPC. Also make sure you rename the file to model.bmd or model.bdl. Hope this works....

--Cuber456 07:44, 26 February 2012 (EST)

It's still not working... I even tested in a room where there is a model.bdl. Otherwise, how are you doing to change the BMD models?

--Dark Linkaël 08:12, 26 February 2012 (EST)

I'm using the program listed on this page. It is a python program. Do a page search for "python 3ds2bdl.py in.3ds template.bdl out.bdl" and it will take you right to the post. I used the python program instead of the exe because the exe didn't work for me. I had to figure out how to set up the python program. According to the programmer, it is just a proof of concept but it does create bdls that are viewable in bmdview2 as you saw. I was hoping that this method would work....

If you want to set the program up yourself and you need help, ask me.

--Cuber456 08:31, 26 February 2012 (EST)

I have a little doubt, I wonder if it's not for a single game It is possible that models BMD / BDL "Wind Waker" is in a slightly different format.

There is that your two models have "J3D2bdl4", so many styles in the game have "J3D2bmd3". This is the case of K_Test6. Trying to make changes to the room "tincle" and send me the file BDL.

--Dark Linkaël 08:44, 26 February 2012 (EST)

Had a bit of trouble getting this one to convert for some reason. I couldn't just export the model from bmdview2 into the python program. I had to have blender import the 3ds file and export it back out before the python program could handle it. Anyway, here are two files:

http://www.mediafire.com/?4cz9ar1pcpb0ctz

http://www.mediafire.com/?xr37awbd5oh6pxu

The first one is to the room "Tincle". The second one is for the Wind Waker baton. If you can't get the room to work, see if you can get the object model to work. You don't think the game crashes because the new models are completely not matched up to the collisions do you? Although it would make more sense if the program I am using doesn't transform correctly... Make sure you give them the proper name and .bdl or .bmd endings.

--Cuber456 21:15, 26 February 2012 (EST)

It's still not working, I'm afraid we will not succeed unless you create a software to create models for BMD and BDL The Wind Waker, I see it as a solution.

I do not think the collision was responsible for this problem.

--Dark Linkaël 07:01, 27 February 2012 (EST)

As much as I want this to succeed, I guess this really won't. For me to create a program that could create BMD or BDL models I feel is beyond what I could ever do in programming. I can do some small programs in java, c, c++ but I have never messed with 3D graphics in those languages. The next logical step would be to try to perfect the converter we have now. The only problem is that it is written in python, a program language I have never really used before. That's not to say that I wouldn't want to learn it. It would probably be good for me to know a scripting language but I won't truly have time for such a thing until summer roles around. One last test should be done, though. Try replacing a model, say Windfall Island, with Outset Island. If it really is the converter I am using that is giving us trouble then the game should allow a real BMD file to replace another BMD file. I mean if the game doesn't allow this there would be no point in creating any program at all.

--Cuber456 07:47, 27 February 2012 (EST)

Some time ago I did this using a hex editor: Old Sky

But since I do not know enough about the system files BMD, I have not been able to do better than that. Yet if I try to look my edits BmdView2 with, he refuses to show me as broken!

If it is possible to make changes with a hex editor, it is probably possible to make a software to create BMD. This is not specifically to you I asked you to do software, but to someone who would be able to do. My translation was not perfect.

I do not think it would be useful to try again, it will not work without doubt.

--Dark Linkaël 08:09, 27 February 2012 (EST)

Oh I understood what you meant about the software. Your translation was fine. I just want this to work so badly and I feel no one is really going to care enough to make the software. Even though this isn't working right now, I won't lay this to rest completely. I can at least promise that much.

--Cuber456 08:35, 27 February 2012 (EST)

Hopefully we get to see a software BMD/BDL one day. Given the many software hacks already available, it should come one day or another. Especially since the BMD models are less complex than some things. Already, I never thought I would see "Viewer Wind", it is really perfect!

Now that Ocarina of Time and Majora's Mask no longer contain too many mysteries, as it is moving to The Wind Waker which much remains to be discovered. One thing is sure, the hack on The Wind Waker is just beginning and I'm sure we will discover still a lot of wonders! The Debug Mode for example!

--Dark Linkaël 08:52, 27 February 2012 (EST)

This isn't anything groundbreaking but I'll talk about this anyway since I find this interesting. I have been doing some tests. These tests have involved taking room and stage arcs within the game and placing them where other room and stage arcs have been. One of the rooms I replaced arc data in was for Hyrule(the folder). No matter what arc data I put in it, it always seemed to refuse to open, whether I try from the debug menu or whether I try by walking out of ganondorf's castle. I tried the different rooms that have large models and I couldn't seem to load arcs from other parts of the game. The only room that I could get to load(so far) other room and stage arcs was was Amos_T. It loaded VrTest, K_Test6 and the collision for A_R00 without a problem. Even when I unpacked and repacked an arc from the game it will always seem to load in Amos_T but not in Hyrule. Needless to say, it won't load an arc with a bdl from the converter. I think I might need to use the debugger in dolphin to figure this one out. I don't see any other options. I'll have to see how a normal bdl file loads and how a converted bdl file loads.

--Cuber456 01:36, 4 March 2012 (EST)

Just for the record, I've been following your discussion and progress with interest. Please don't think you're the only ones who care about making this work. I wish I knew anything that could help you! Have you asked JaytheHam or xdaniel for assistance?

GlitterBerri 04:48, 4 March 2012 (EST)

I actually haven't even thought about asking either of them for some reason. I don't know why. I'll shoot an email over to xdaniel first and then JaytheHam. Perhaps one of them will provide some guidance.

--Cuber456 05:12, 4 March 2012 (EST)

What is very annoying though, is this stupid logic to limit the size of a file. Forced to make smaller than the original file, it limits a lot of hacker attempts.

However, I am sure that sooner or later it will be possible to play here, but it will no textures, it is unrecoverable.

--Dark Linkaël 06:16, 4 March 2012 (EST)

How about using Gamecube Rebuilder instead of GC-Tool? Unlike GC-Tool it actually lets you insert bigger files into the game.

About the BMD you made, just rotate it and reconvert it.

--Kargaroc 06:27, 4 March 2012 (EST)

Hmm... I used Gamecube Rebuilder and there is always that limit file size to be observed.

--Dark Linkaël 06:32, 4 March 2012 (EST)

Unfortunately the BDL that it made doesn't seem to line up with the collision. I don't know why this is.

Also, the BDLs that it makes look absolutely terrible ingame. Video of R_00 with custom BDL

If you wonder how I made this, I used a ARC packer that I acquired from somewhere (I think it was from JayTheHam). The game will load uncompressed RARCs, even if the original was compressed. Also, it doesn't expect models to be in a particular format. For instance, if you make a folder called "BDL" in a map that primarily uses BMDs, and put a BDL in it, then it should load just fine. That's what I did.

--Kargaroc 08:20, 4 March 2012 (EST)

Ok, finally some good news is appearing about how to import this! I'll see what I can do about making the model line up with the collision. Hopefully I will be able to do something about that. As for the BDLs looking terrible, there is nothing I can do about that. The converter I used is, according to the programmer, is just a proof of concept. It will only take one texture from a bdl and use that for every texture. Like I said earlier though, I don't care what the model looks like too much as long as I can see the model but I'll try different textures anyway to see what stands out more. In the future, when a more advanced converter that uses more textures appears, someone 1000 times more ambitious than I am can go through the process of restoring the textures and maybe if they are more ambitious still, they can put moblins in. As I am currently busy right now with other crap, I'll try to get something produced within a week. However, if someone wants it done now then be my guest. Everything provided in this discussion will tell you how to convert 3DS to BDL files and how to import them. By the way Kargaroc, thanks for the info and thanks for the video, especially the beginning. Seeing the trolololo gave me a laugh :)

--Cuber456 12:49, 4 March 2012 (EST)

You know, when there's a file that's too big, I do one of two things: I either 1) use a YAZ0 encoder to shrink the file, or 2) use the program GCR. To use GCR the way I do, you need to dump the entire game with the program. Then you just replace the .arc with your new one in the appropriate folder, rebuild the ISO, and voila! There's a larger file where a smaller one was. What's nice about that is that you can replace it with the original file while retaining the ability to add something larger there.

Those two options, either encoding it or rebuilding the entire thing, have really helped me with trying to document the game's DZR, DZS and other misc. files.

-Gamma 20:15, 7 March 2012 (EST)

Well I've figured out how to import files of any size into TWW using gamecube rebuilder. However I still can't get the new model to load like when Kargaroc did it. Instead of sitting for 4 hours going in circles trying to figure this out, I'll explain my process of importing the file and hopefully someone will point out my stupid error(s).


 * Step 1 Open the GC image in GCR.
 * Step 2 Extract the root somewhere.
 * Step 3 Find the Room0.arc for AR00, unpack it, replace the old model.bmd with the new model.bdl, pack it.
 * Step 4 Place the new Room.arc back where the old one was.
 * Step 5 Open the root folder in GCR, save the GC image and rebuild.

Is there something I am missing here? It seems so straight forward but I just can't get the room to load with the new model. What am I doing wrong here???

--Cuber456 23:09, 7 March 2012 (EST)

You must rename the BMD folder to BDL, because that's how the game looks for resources. It loads BMDs from the BMD folder, BDLs from the BDL folder, and so on. If you put a BDL in the BMD folder it won't work.

You have to rename the BMD folder to BDL.

--Kargaroc 23:13, 7 March 2012 (EST)

No go. That didn't work either. I'll be honest, with the amount of trouble I am having loading this file, I'm very surprised that you were able to get it working so quickly.

I took the Room0.arc, unpacked it, replaced the old model with the new one, renamed the bmd folder to bdl and followed the same procedure as before. Just to be clear, when I say that the map doesn't load from the debug menu, I mean that the game crashes. I just don't understand this at all..... am I the only one who can't get this map to load with this procedure?

--Cuber456 00:05, 8 March 2012 (EST)

The only advice I can give is: Make sure that you delete any debugout.txt files

What arc packer are you using? I use this one http://dl.dropbox.com/u/16672629/arcpacker.7z

--Kargaroc 07:30, 8 March 2012 (EST)

Unfortunately, still no go. I redownloaded the BDL file from here, made sure there were no debugout.txt files in the folder and used your arc packer. I have no idea why this still isn't working. Am I the only one who can't get this bdl file to load using this method? Perhaps Kargaroc is using special settings in dolphin? Maybe this is the reason because I was able to load the island model from VRtest into A_nami using this method and it worked fine and I had no problems at all. The game didn't crash like when loading this custom bdl file. Kargaroc, what are some of the setting you use for dolphin and what is the version? If I am not able to get this map to load then there will be no point for me to try to align the model to the collision. In other words, the project will end here.

--Cuber456 11:19, 8 March 2012 (EST)

Strange... I tried importing that BDL the same way I imported the one I made... And it crashed.

Perhaps it's a faulty conversion?

--Kargaroc 11:30, 8 March 2012 (EST)

So are you saying that you made your own bdl file from the converter and didn't take the one I made? If that is the case then it would mean that somehow I am not able to produce the correct conversion for any bdl files even though they show up in bmdview2. That would explain why Dark Linkaël wasn't able to make any of my converted bdl files load in the game but why you are able to make the map load with ease. What texture did you use when creating the file? I used the texture of the deku leaf but maybe if I use the texture you are using it will work for me. If this doesn't work then I would have to figure out what is wrong with the converter itself.

--Cuber456 11:59, 8 March 2012 (EST)

Not very long ago, I tried to use the "vr_box.bmd" being in the room "Tincle" by replacing a vr_box final version. I did not succeed and the only way I managed to do is to have used a hex editor. For a result that is not really extraordinary. These models BMD/BDL are really stubborn and tough! One thing is sure, we must not lose hope.

--Dark Linkaël 12:42, 8 March 2012 (EST)

I have come to the conclusion that the Sketchup model of the Alpha forest collision has been scaled.

I downloaded it and did everything I could to keep the scale correct while converting it, and it was still smaller than the actual collision.

We need to convert the original DZB back to an OBJ again.

--Kargaroc 11:20, 9 March 2012 (EST)

I think this is a good solution to take, but you must know what to do.

--Dark Linkaël 11:33, 9 March 2012 (EST)

Yes, the google sketchup model has been scaled. I think you can make it bigger though in blender. At least that's what I though I did if you can see the picture above. For the first time, I am able to load a converted model of a box into the game. I need to rebuild the forest from the sketchup model though because I think the current version I am using is corrupt or something.

Now on this second method that Kargaroc proposes, what exactly is an OBJ file? How would we convert to this and from this to a bmd/bdl?

--Cuber456 14:36, 9 March 2012 (EST)

I've figured out that whatever 3ds file my version(latest version) of blender touches renders any converted bdl file useless in game(it crashes) for whatever reason. For example, I am able to import a model that was exported straight out of bmdview2. I am not able to import a file exported from bmdview2, and then exported from blender. I find this very strange. Yet Kargaroc can do this within minutes it seems. I must be stupid or something................

--Cuber456 01:52, 11 March 2012 (EST)

Well I think I proved that I am stupid. I have just figured out why I could never import anything from blender. I never did full UV mapping with any of the models I produced. This is important because it seems all models in the wind waker use this. Putting in a model that wasn't fully UV mapped must have been what made the game choke. After correcting this error, I was able to get the map to finally import.



I apologize for my stupidity. I will now see what I can do to make the model match the collision.

--Cuber456 04:29, 11 March 2012 (EDT)

No, this project isn't dead. I've been busy doing other things lately but this is what I got so far.



The replacement model seems to match closely with the collision model as shown in the first picture. On closer inspection, the model is still somewhat off in the second and third picture. I am having a hard time trying to align it any further because I can't modify the model in real time. The only way I can do anything is to modify the model in blender, convert it, and then view it in WWViewer. Hopefully I can continue this.

--Cuber456 17:35, 20 March 2012 (EDT)

I think this is appropriate before clicking the second link

the second link

My original goal is now complete.

--Cuber456 05:31, 24 March 2012 (EDT)

Congratulations to you, I do not think it would go as fast for the final result! The oldest room of The Wind Waker is now playable! Now, is it possible to put the textures?

--Dark Linkaël 05:54, 24 March 2012 (EDT)

Are you asking if it is possible to texture the the room as it appeared in the original trailer? Sadly, at this point in time, I don't think so. The converter I used can only take textures from another .bdl or .bmd and use those textures for the whole model. Besides telling the converter what .bdl or .bmd files to take textures from, the converter just applies the textures how it feels. The converter would have to be developed more in order to allow more textures to be used and applied in specific ways. What would actually be better is if the textures applied to the .3ds model (in blender) could be transferred to the .bdl model. That would allow us an easy way to reapply the textures of the old room. I'll talk with the programmer of the converter to see if this is a possibility.

On the other hand, I've noticed that the Wind Waker will load more than one room model depending on how they are named(hyrule is a good example of this). If I were to separate the room into independent models(for example, trees, floor, walls, path), I could convert them separately and using different textures. This isn't nearly ideal as what I said in the previous paragraph but it would at least give the room different colors/textures so it would be easier to tell what is what compared to what I have in the video.

--Cuber456 06:31, 24 March 2012 (EDT)

I posted this info on the forums but I might as well post it here as well. I'll sum up what I said but check the thread for TWW if you need more info. I am thinking of releasing this model so other people can fool around with it and do whatever. I changed some of the textures so that the map is more visible than it was before(aka not tall green). Here is a video of what the updated model looks like. Here is a video of the old model just for comparison. My question is does the new model look ok? Should I make any changes before I release it?

--Cuber456 01:59, 2 June 2012 (EDT)

It already seems more correct and cleaner than the old version. It only remains to try to put the textures of the forest of Outset Island, but it's still complicated.

--Dark Linkaël 05:23, 2 June 2012 (EDT)

Your model is apparently too complex on a console. I tested the room on my Wii using Dios Mios and the result is a black screen. I also tested the room that I added "TF_03DL" and it works wonderfully.

I wonder if he put several BMD models is that good. You can not put him only one BMD model?

--Dark Linkaël 05:31, 15 July 2012 (EDT)

I guess it isn't too surprising that it won't work on a real console. We are lucky enough to have it run in Dolphin. Which version of the model did you test? There are two versions that I included in the download link from the youtube page. There is one version where the AR00 model is broken into a few different BDL models(color model) and then there is another version where I use a single BDL model(green yellow model). If you haven't tried one version of the model then try it. If both models don't work then there isn't much that I can do. The error obviously lies within the custom BDL models but I have no idea how the 3DS to BDL converter works and I have no idea what the real console is rejecting about the models. If the BDL converter is the problem then the only thing we can do is wait for a better one to show up on the web. I'll keep my eyes open for a better converter. It has been 5 months since I found the original 3DS to BDL converter. When one does show up, I will gladly make a new model for you or anyone else to try.

--Cuber456 06:14, 15 July 2012 (EDT)

I used the version with the colors.

We must find a method to integrate other BMD models on the first and main model. Moreover, the original collision "A_R00" is only one file. You should know that we must have the same number of BMD files and DZB in a room. In the case of "A_R00", there are several files BMD/BDL, but only one file DZB. I think this is the problem. If it is not yet possible to solve the problem, we will see later. Good luck if you try to fix that!

Add more rooms in the ISO of the game is no problem on a console, but it has to be done with a very clean method. "TF_03" is restored, I should try to do the same for "E3ROOP" but the file "stage.dzs" cause serious problems!

--Dark Linkaël 07:38, 15 July 2012 (EDT)

I think I understand what you are saying in English but your reason for why the game crashes doesn't make sense. Are you saying that the game crashes because there is more than one BDL present for the new A_R00 while there should only be one BDL like in the original? My problem with this reason is that it doesn't make sense why the console should care how many BDLs are in a room. Look at any room in the game. All the rooms have one DZB file but can have any number of BDL files. Hypothetically speaking, if we look at a room at random, it will have X BDL files(X is a variable). If your reason is true, then if we increase the number of BDLs in a room to any number greater than X then the game will crash on a console.

For example, look at the room for Hyrule(literally in the "hyrule" folder). It only one DZB collision and it has four BDL models. If your reason for the game crashing is true then adding another BDL model(preferably not a custom BDL) to this room should also crash the game because there would be five BDL models, not four. IF this is true then the green yellow version of the model should work because it is only one BDL file.

I'll simplify what I am saying. If you can get the green yellow version of the model working on the console then there might be some hope to getting the color version working. This will show that it isn't the custom model that is the problem but the console being stubborn. I have two ideas on how to make the color version BDL work on the console but I need you to confirm that the custom green yellow version of the model works on console. If it doesn't work then my ideas would be pointless.

--Cuber456 16:15, 15 July 2012 (EDT)

Holy crap, talk about luck. Apparently the programmer who created the 3DS to BDL converter that I used is making an OBJ to BMD converter to be released by the end of the week if everything goes well. He announced it here(you might need to be logged in to see it though). What makes this especially cool is the fact that this converter will allow us to use CUSTOM TEXTURES! This is it!! We now have a chance to fully restore the original textures to this room!!! I'm going to get to work prepping an OBJ model that I will be converting to a BMD model and hopefully the whole process will be smooth. Dark Linkaël, I hope that you will be willing to test this model on a real console when I am finished with it!

--Cuber456 18:24, 18 July 2012 (EDT)

Ah, this is good news! I am ready to test once you have made ​​the model with textures!

--Dark Linkaël 05:58, 19 July 2012 (EDT)

I'll provide some small updates from time to time to give you guys an idea of where I am with this project. This is what I am looking into right now:


 * The OBJ to BDL converter has been released as a Python program. I've tried using the program to convert simple models but I am having trouble getting the program to work. It keeps giving me errors and I will need more time with it before I understand how to use it properly. Until I can understand how this program works, I will not be able to texture a model for A_R00.


 * Since I am expecting to restore all of the textures back to this room, I am trying to figure out how to add the mushrooms into the model since they are currently absent. The specific problem I am having with the mushrooms is that I can't UV map any of them in Blender. It doesn't matter if you don't know what UV mapping is but any polygons not UV mapped will not show up in a BDL when converted. I am trying to simplify and fix the polygons of the mushrooms in hopes to solve this problem.

This is a bumpy start and the road ahead looks bumpy too but it shouldn't be impossible to get by these two problems.

--Cuber456 23:18, 22 July 2012 (EDT)

Take your time, it's better to make slow work and clean. For sure this is not something very easy to do, but since you have already restored the oldest room in the game, you are able to do other interesting stuff.

In the meantime, get used to this new version of the program on the textures and models.

--Dark Linkaël 06:24, 23 July 2012 (EDT)

SubD45 : Unused ?


I begin to have doubts about a room... The place SubD45 contains three rooms, three ghost ships. However, two of them contain chests with 50 and 100 rupees. I've never seen it since I played. Did you know that?

--Dark Linkaël 12:41, 28 February 2012 (EST)

Yeah, as far as I know there's only one Ghost Ship- the one containing the Triforce Chart. Unused.

-Gamma 20:21, 28 February 2012 (EST)

Warning, there are several kinds of Ghost Ships. It's strange though, it seems to tell me something, except rupees at the end.

The place SubD71 also has two Ghost Ships, but they are really not used because of some defects such as lack of such chests. Moreover, there is a folder "BDL" with copies of model Ghost Ship.

--Dark Linkaël 07:38, 29 February 2012 (EST)

No, unless I'm being forgetful, there's only ever one place the game uses the Ghost Ship's interior.

Also, I want to change the description of the third unused room in Siren. It's way too small to be a boss room; I'm thinking that after the boss battle, you'd walk around the outside of the tower to that room, which would hold a teleport to the bell.

-Gamma 18:26, 29 February 2012 (EST)

I can back up Gamma's claim. I can only remember visiting the ghost ship once and that was to get a triforce chart. Plus this site says the only reward from the ghost ship is the triforce chart.

--Cuber456 21:52, 29 February 2012 (EST)

The place "PShip" contains three ghost ships and I know them. By cons for "SubD45" and "SubD71" I do not know them at all. So it is unused in this case.

It is interesting to see that with Wind Viewer, you can know the locations of unused rooms. In "kaze", there is actually an old boss room small, one where the floor is covered with sand.

--Dark Linkaël 05:42, 1 March 2012 (EST)

About converting big minimaps
Usually they're tile-based. How do you convert them to normal PNGs without them looking like tilesets?

For instance, this is what the big minimap of E3 Outset looks like image

How would you convert something like that into a normal image?

--Kargaroc 03:53, 5 March 2012 (EST)

I know and I tried to do it well for the mini-map "2D MAP ダミー", but it's too complicated to do manually. However, there are three mini-map files, with two ".bti" and the other ".amp". The one with the format "amp" seems to be related to Photoshop.

--Dark Linkaël 05:30, 5 March 2012 (EST)

It seems that the .amp files map out what tiles to use where. However, the large BTI already has one of these after the tile data.

I guess the BTI converter isn't capable of reading them yet and outputs tilesets instead.

--Kargaroc 05:24, 16 March 2012 (EST)

No, it is not possible...

Otherwise, I found this:

•Photoshop (Arbitrary Map Settings) by Adobe Systems Incorporated The structure of *.AMP is very simple. It has 5 tables that have 256 entries that are 8-bit (byte). The first table 0000..00FFh is the RGB channel. The second table 0100..01FFh is the R channel. The third table 0200..02FFh is the G channel. The fourth table 0300..03FFh is the B channel. And, the fifth table 0400..04FFh is a "dummy" channel that has to be filled with codes running from 00h, 01h, 02h, ...FFh. Table position nn00h is the black end and table position nnFFh is the white end.

A link or not with the files "amp" in TWW?

--Dark Linkaël 06:35, 16 March 2012 (EDT)

small oddity
A little while ago I downloaded the latest version of wind viewer(1/30/12) and played around with it. It's amazing what the program does. Anyway, I was looking through some arcs from the Wind Waker in this program and comparing the same arc files in a hex editor. One of the files I glanced over in the program and in the hex editor was the room arc for A_nami. I specifically had a hex editor open the dzr file and I came across something a little odd but it is probably just me. At the address 0x74, the file has the hex string "Boss02". The only reference to the string within Wind Viewer is under the option RCAM which I have no idea what that option is. Is this possibly something of interest or is this me just finding random strings within a random file?

--Cuber456 04:22, 1 April 2012 (EDT)


 * Don't quote me on this, but I'm pretty sure RCAM in the .dzrs determines how the camera behaves- for example, so it can't go outside the bounds of the room. So, "Boss02" might tell the camera to act the way it does for the Kalle Demos battle (or any boss battle, really). I'm sorry, but I don't think that's unused. -Gamma 23:35, 30 April 2012 (EDT)

unused items
I was playing around with the "have bottle on slot 1234" cheat code. Depending on the item ID (and what slot is used, apparently, which is odd), you can get a bunch of unused and weird items. http://i.imgur.com/R52Rr.jpg

--Mugg1991 06:49, 17 April 2012 (EDT)

Please make sure you put your signature at the end when you are done so I don't have to. It can be slightly difficult to know who is talking.

Anyway, I don't think any of those items are unused. The first two pictures look like pieces of the triforce and the next picture just has icons for the names of melodies. Your cheat codes seem to be pulling items/pictures/info from the second subscreen and placing them where the bottles usually go. The last picture has items that are used. Have you ever done the item trading quest in the game or searched for tingle statues?

--Cuber456 07:03, 17 April 2012 (EDT)

I'm afraid I haven't.

The item description of the earth god's lyric says "You got the hero's new clothes... / What the... ? / Wow, they're really light...". Is that unused text, or no?

Also, I wasn't aware how to make a proper signature. I asked in the IRC and noone answered within 10 minutes when I was about to go to sleep.

--Mugg1991


 * Regarding the clothes text, I'm pretty sure that's used when you receive your new "clothes" at the start of a New Game+. As for a signature, type two dashes followed by four tildes or simply click the signature button in the toolbar (the second to last one). --Smallhacker 18:50, 17 April 2012 (EDT)


 * Yeah, that's the "Item Get" description for the Hero's New Clothes- which is kind of bizarre, considering it's the last string in the text file, rather than the first (which is "You can only all Tingle from places with maps!"). I wonder why it pulls that string? --Gamma 23:29, 30 April 2012 (EDT)

Rooms 6 and 7 of the Wind Temple
While using Wind Viewer, I discovered that the long wind chamber in the Wind Temple (Room 7) once had another room attached to it (Room 6):

http://i48.tinypic.com/bheouc.png

http://i47.tinypic.com/2lwm7v7.png

Room 6 was probably left out because the development team thought they had enough random circular rooms. However, the model is the only thing intact- the map files bundled with it display the UNDER CONSTRUCTION kanji, and the collision is that of the mini-boss room. Because of the collision, it's impossible to play. However, Wind Viewer reveals some other remnants- there's a spawn point hidden beneath the floor in Room 7 right where the door to Room 6 would have been. It seems that Room 6 was dropped fairly early. --Gamma 20:57, 2 May 2012 (EDT)


 * It is interesting to see where was the old rooms in the dungeons. Especially in Tower of the Gods where the two corridors with blue bricks are replaced by two rooms with statues to carry. The old boss room located just below the old version from the top of the Tower of the Gods.

--Dark Linkaël 07:42, 1 June 2012 (EDT)

Door leftover?
On behalf of Abahbob, I'm posting about what seems to be a leftover. A door that's underneath/behind the huge door in Forsaken Fortress, where the Phantom Ganon battle is triggered during your second visit. Can be used in both directions. (I haven't tried it myself yet.)

Wireframe Mode pics: http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f318/abahbob/GZLJ01-18.png

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f318/abahbob/GZLJ01-17-1.png

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f318/abahbob/GZLJ01-18-1.png

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f318/abahbob/GZLJ01-19.png

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f318/abahbob/GZLJ01-20.png

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f318/abahbob/GZLJ01-21.png

http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f318/abahbob/GZLJ01-22.png

Normal: http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f318/abahbob/GZLJ01-24.png

--Mugg1991 01:07, 28 May 2012 (EDT)

Seems like all big doors have these leftover doors under them.

--Mugg1991 01:19, 28 May 2012 (EDT)

More pics: http://s50.photobucket.com/albums/f318/abahbob/TWW/

--Mugg1991 01:49, 28 May 2012 (EDT)

After checking for myself, I can confirm this. It seems most(if not all) of the big doors in the Forsaken Fortress have regular, rectangular, doors underneath them. These would have to be leftovers. It seems logical to guess that these were probably placeholders before the big doors were put in. This makes me wonder if there are any leftover doors without the big doors over them.... At any rate, if I were you, I would definitely add this to the page.

--Cuber456 15:41, 28 May 2012 (EDT)

I checked this out in Wind Viewer, and it seems that the door underneath is where the object is located. So it seems as if they are not leftovers, they are part of the object. There is no object in place of the larger doors.

--Abahbob 20:55, 28 May 2012 (EDT)

Demo46, ENDumi and Sea_E
I was looking though the cutscene archives again, and I came across something surprising- the cutscene archive for the ending! It's Demo46.arc. Normally, the ending is shown as .thp movie, but it looks like they may have intended to play it in real time. Even though it's selectable from the map select, it's broken. It seems that something was removed. The map select, I believe, loads Sea_E, which is a duplicate of Outset Island with a unique actor setup (notably having a version of the pirate ship out in the distance and a floating Aryll). ENDumi is probably where they filmed the sequence were Link and Tetra float up from Hyrule and meet Tetra's ship.

Another thing that I find fascinating as that the text shown in the .thp, Tetra's speech, actually exists in the game's text! I will post pics and what-not later. -Gamma 16:59, 31 May 2012 (EDT)


 * I feel like you mentioned this on the forums. This is something you should definitively mention on the page once when you gather your materials. Here is another piece of info that might interest you and that I find slightly strange. I was looking at Sea_E and comparing Sea_T. They look really similar. They have arc files of the same name and the models and collisions are similar. The Room0.arc in Sea_E has a random starting point for Link way up above the collision while the Room.arc in Sea_T doesn't have a starting point for Link at all. The Room44.arc in both Seas is Outset Island. The Outset Island in Sea_E looks pretty normal and the Sea_T looks almost normal. The weird thing with the Outset Island in Sea_T is the fact that it only has one spawning point for Link. That spawning point is right behind Mesa's House! Long story short, you should also look at Sea_T since it seems very related to Sea_E but that is just my opinion.

--Cuber456 17:39, 31 May 2012 (EDT)


 * Sea_T is the location that is loaded for the title screen. The spawn point might have been used for testing, but if you really want, I can look into it.-Gamma 20:34, 31 May 2012 (EDT)


 * Ah, that makes sense. I didn't realize Sea_T was the title screen map. I was just suggesting you look at it since the two Seas look very similar to each other. You don't have to if you don't want to. By the way, do you know which folder contains the the dungeon for the Wind Temple?

--Cuber456 20:57, 31 May 2012 (EDT)


 * "Sea_T" is the title screen and "Sea_E" is certainly the scene of the departure of Link on the pirate ship.


 * "ENDumi" is really the place used to be the ending scene, there is no doubt on it.


 * It is normal to see the text of Tetra being in the ending scene. However, it is invisible in the file ".thp" because it is only a movie and he had to translate for other languages ​​(example: European). Nintendo did not make multiple copies of the file "thp" for each language.

--Dark Linkaël 06:16, 1 June 2012 (EDT)


 * The Wind Temple's files are stored in the folder called "Kaze."


 * As for Dark Linkaël... what do you mean? Does the European one call the strings from bmgres.arc? Or does it use some kind of programming that displays different text for each language? -Gamma 07:20, 1 June 2012 (EDT)

The European version has more than due to language files.

USA:

/res/Msg/bmgres.arc

EUR:

/res/Msg/data0/bmgres.arc

/res/Msg/data1/bmgres.arc

/res/Msg/data2/bmgres.arc

/res/Msg/data3/bmgres.arc

/res/Msg/data4/bmgres.arc

There is also the file "acticon.arc" in these folders.

--Dark Linkaël 07:33, 1 June 2012 (EDT)

acticon.arc contains the HUD button icons, so it makes sense that each language would have its own file. But I was asking about the .thp- you said there is only one file, so how does it change the language? -Gamma 17:31, 1 June 2012 (EDT)


 * To change the language in the European version, there is a button "langague" at the bottom of the screen "File Selection".


 * However, I do not know if you knew it was possible to read files "thp" with a small program. When you watch the scene with Tetra, there is no text visible, but just the textbox.

--Dark Linkaël 05:17, 2 June 2012 (EDT)

USA bmgres.arc- Other Language Names
I meant to mention this a few weeks ago, but I forgot about it. In the text for the American version of TWW, the strings "Deutsch," "Espanol," (Spelled incorrectly) "Italia" and "French" can be found. This is weird, mostly because Dark Linkael says that each language has its own bmgres.arc in Europe. -Gamma 17:28, 1 June 2012 (EDT)

More version differences
Here are some pointers for more version differences, some already known, some found out on twitch.tv/cosmowright today:


 * There is smoke in the entrance room before Dragon Roost Cavern on the Japanese version. There is (almost?) none in other versions.


 * When standing right in front of a wall, you won't be able to aim all the way up with the hookshot.


 * The golden ship doesn't drop the 5th(?) Triforce piece, but a sea chart which points to another sea chart (etc.) until one points at the piece.


 * I heard some cutscenes are missing in J.


 * One of the Koroks who is floating around at the end of a Deku Tree cutscene has a louder propeller sound in J.


 * The outside of the tower of the gods is "different".

--Mugg1991 17:37, 11 July 2012 (EDT)

Alright.


 * A difference in smoke is plausible, mostly because smoke and other particle effects are easily added/removed from maps.


 * I'm pretty sure that's all versions.


 * That's a known difference.


 * "Some cutscenes?" Have any idea which ones? I honestly don't think that they'd add cutscenes for the other versions.


 * That's reasonable.


 * What do you mean by "different?" I'm pretty sure it's the same in all versions. I also saw a Japanese trailer that had the same Tower that's in the other versions.

All in all, I think we need to check these. Anyone have a copy of the Japanese ISO?

-Gamma 11:20, 13 July 2012 (EDT)


 * The Hookshot difference is there. It makes a certain speedrunning trick very hard on the Japanese version, known as the Cabana deed skip. This trick involves aiming at a tree with the hookshot when partially inside the wall. And you can't aim upwards when close to a wall like this, on the Japanese version, you can only aim forward (and very slightly upward depending on how close to the wall you are). This difference exists.


 * The golden ship difference wasn't documented on the main page so I pointed it out here.


 * As for missing cutscenes: When Link gets tossed out to the sea after his first visit at Forsaken Fortress, the cutscene where he floats on the sea and the King of Red Lions approaches isn't there on the Japanese version. They seem to have added it to the English version to make more sense and explain how Link ended up at Windfall island.


 * The outside part of Tower of the gods being "different" is something I heard on Cosmo's stream when I wasn't really paying attention. I don't really know what's different specifically.

--Mugg1991 15:22, 18 July 2012 (EDT)


 * After you get the Mastersword, King of Red Lions will tell you something along the lines of "Kill all the enemies" on the Japanese version. He doesn't say anything on the other versions.


 * A sound effect is missing from the Japanese version.

--Mugg1991 11:04, 19 July 2012 (EDT)


 * I'm pretty sure, on the password entering for pirateship2 is case sensitive on PAL only.

--Mugg1991 15:33, 21 July 2012 (EDT)


 * In the Tower of the Gods' first room, there is a light mist only in the Japanese version.

--Mugg1991 08:12, 19 September 2012 (EDT)

European Tingle Tuner difference?
Okay, I'm simply going by vague memories here, so there may be some inaccuracies. When you're using the Tingle Tuner on Outset Island, it triggers a mini-quest with that blue Tingle (was his name "Knuckle" or something?) where you have to follow certain steps to unlock him back on the Tingle Island. Now, my brother and I tried this thing countless times. What confused us the most was that the text relating to the final(?) step (flying with the leaf from the top of the mountain) did not match the descriptions in walkthroughs we found online. IIRC, the instructions we got were a lot more vague and non-descriptive. We tried to instead follow the online walkthroughs and fly to that one remote cliff, but nothing ever happened. So, despite trying several times on several different occasions, we never managed to beat this mini-quest.

As I don't have the game, console or even a TV easily available, I can't go back and double-check the details. It'd be great if someone could look into it though. I'd love to know what exactly was going on there. --Smallhacker 20:56, 11 July 2012 (EDT)

Beta Sage Stone Texture
I was dumping textures once more (see the last edit to my post in the TWW thread on the forum), and while looking through the objects I came across the object for the stones that block the way to Earth and Wind Temples. Now, there are actually THREE models- one for Medli's harp, one for Makar's violin and one that seems to contain the rubble effect that happens when you have the sages play their respective songs. While the two normal stones didn't have anything interesting, the third one did:



Note the rough drawing of the harp and the Ocarina of Time-style musical score. What this means is unclear. I have to go, so I'll come back to this. Please check out the thread on the forums! -Gamma 19:26, 17 July 2012 (EDT)

This is interesting stuff you found. I don't know where you pulled that pic from in the ISO but here is what the Earth Temple's Sage Stone looks like, just for some comparison.



The harp looks similar to the one that Medli uses in the final game. What I find more interesting is Ocarina of Time-style musical score you point out. It doesn't look like the wind waker baton instruction presented on the final stone. There are also eight notes on there. The wind waker can only conduct six 'notes'. I have some ideas about what these unused graphics could have been used for but I would be lying if I said I wasn't speculating. Nice find! --Cuber456 20:57, 17 July 2012 (EDT)

I'd like to hear some of your theories. Please, go ahead and share them!

Also, the image is the texture of the Sage Stone model called mknjh.bdl. Meaning that the harp would have been in place of the final harp and the music score would have been in place of the Wind Waker directions. -Gamma 21:13, 17 July 2012 (EDT)

Take these with a grain of salt. One theory is perhaps these graphics were suppose to be for a third stone for a third temple. Another (and maybe more likely) theory I have is perhaps you were suppose to control Medli and play the song on her harp in the unused graphics you found. This would make some sense since the wind waker never uses that style of musical score for conducting the wind waker. My last theory is that these graphics are simply just an early version of the Sage Stone for the earth temple. The graphics for the musical score could be an early version of what the conducting instructions for the Wind Waker looked like. Like I said take these with a grain of salt. --Cuber456 21:36, 17 July 2012 (EDT)

I see. Interesting theories. Someone should get Ocarina of Time and see what those notes sound like in that game. -Gamma 21:46, 17 July 2012 (EDT)

Also, the texture of the broken stone on Dragon Roost Island dedicated to Cyclos has an arrow icon in it that isn't used anywhere else:



Wonder why it's there? -Gamma 21:59, 17 July 2012 (EDT)

Well here is what they sound like in OoT but I don't know if it really matters. I feel like you can make a tune out of any notes if you play them right. It is interesting that the eight notes on the unused graphic fit in a musical score in OoT though. The reason why the unused graphic on the broken stone went unused could be for anything. --Cuber456 22:12, 17 July 2012 (EDT)

Very nice discovery! You did well to search the textures in the game, because there are certainly still things to see. It is a discovery that interests me greatly and was made ​​of how the musical notes.

For the second, the arrow means nothing to me. It is therefore not used any in the game. You can add these wonders on the page!

--Dark Linkaël 05:50, 18 July 2012 (EDT)

You know Gamma, I am kind of happy you brought this up. I didn't realize how useful ripping graphics from models could be. I didn't think that there were hidden graphics within those models. I did a quick look at some models and actually found something unused myself.



This texture belongs to Maggie. It is in the exact same model folder where I found her unused animation that is now on the main page (Object/Pm/bdlm/pm.bdl). Judging from the texture and from the texture's name which is "pm_eye.5.png", this was suppose to be the fifth frame of animation for her eye. The texture looks like it is a placeholder. I think the final model uses at least the first three frames of animation. I am having a hard time figuring out if the fourth frame of animation for the eye is used though. I am leaning towards it being unused but it is hard to tell. The fourth frame looks almost the exact same as this unused texture except that it has a pupil instead of a 5. Can someone help me determine if the fourth frame is used? I'll add the eye textures to the page when we get this figured out.

--Cuber456 07:32, 18 July 2012 (EDT)

Yeah, I found something similar to that graphic in the beta Fado model- where eye and mouth graphics should be, there are only small numbers.

Alright... judging by the other eye textures, I'd say that the fifth graphic was supposed to be another eye texture- except, they never got around to finishing its pupil.

The other eye seems to be a 'surprised' graphic. It might be unused, but we should take a look at the Forsaken Fortress cutscenes (where Maggie is) and see if her eyes animate as well as her body. Have you looked at Milla's yet?

Speaking of other textures, I dumped the textures of the inside of the pirate ship. This is the map in Tetra's cabin(you can see it in-game on the back wall):



My question is if we can take this as an earlier version of the map. The topmost point of the Triforce drawing is Dragon Roost- that looks the same. The lowest, Forest Haven, which is only missing one of the round satellite islands. The third point is Greatfish Isle, but... it definitely doesn't look like the final island. You can see other islands (including Outset and Headstone near the bottom left, Forsaken Fortress in the upper left and Mother and Child isles near it).

The Triangle islands make up the inner trangle of the Triforce drawing, but... what's that gigantic island that's in the center of it? That's definitely not there in the final game. I've actually always wondered about that.

So. Early map kept in the game, or abstract representation? -Gamma 12:51, 18 July 2012 (EDT)

I would say it is just an abstract representation because it made it into the final game. Honestly, it could go either way though and because of this, it shouldn't be added to the main page unless there is evidence that can prove it.

You could be right about the fourth eye texture. It could be a surprised frame. I'll have to check demo 7 and demo 23 to see if it gets used. I'll also check out textures for Mila's model since you mention it as well. For now I will add that unused 5th eye frame I found to the main page. I also highly recommend that you at least add the unused textures for the harp and the musical score that you found to the main page. Such nice finds shouldn't be left out of the main page!

--Cuber456 15:38, 18 July 2012 (EDT)

Alright, I will.

I think we should reformat the page first, though. It seems... disorganized to me. My suggestion would be to make the Unused Models (and now textures) all one sub-page. Does that work?

-Gamma 16:47, 18 July 2012 (EDT)

Now that you mention it, the page does look disorganized. It is not like there are only a few models and textures on the page. There are so many that I feel that they stretch the page. Models and textures literally take up more than half of the page. I definitely think that making a sub-page for models and textures is a good idea. Gamma, do you want to make the sub-page?

--Cuber456 17:00, 18 July 2012 (EDT)

I'm not really sure how to. If you could make the page, I could re-organize it from there.

-Gamma 17:02, 18 July 2012 (EDT)

Ok. Let me try then. You at least added the tab for the new-sub page.

--Cuber456 17:17, 18 July 2012 (EDT)

Done! I created a new sub-page and I moved everything dealing with textures and models to it! Do as you please reorganizing the new sub-page but make sure you add your unused finds soon.

--Cuber456 17:38, 18 July 2012 (EDT)

OK. I've started on it, but it's not finished yet. I'll finish it soon. -Gamma 18:27, 18 July 2012 (EDT)

You know, I thought I read somewhere that the Wind Waker started out as a "Therimin" (sp) -like device. Could it be that the sage stone texture is from that period...? In all liklihood no, but it's interesting to think about. -Gamma 20:26, 18 July 2012 (EDT)

Well of course stuff like that is interesting to think about but you know the drill. We need to find evidence for stuff unused on the ISO. Speaking of unused stuff, I think I figured out that the fourth frame of animation for the eye is used. You were correct to ask me to check the demos for the Forsaken Fortress. I only checked Demo 7 but there is an animation called "07_pm_cut3furimuki.btp" that makes Maggie open her eyes and it looks like that fourth frame of animation. Plus if that isn't proof enough, here is a link where Maggie looks like she is using the animation. I know the video is of demo 23 but I believe I see that fourth frame of her eye being used. I guess I'll update the page to say this but I think it is interesting to note that both the 4th and 5th frames look very similar.

--Cuber456 21:24, 18 July 2012 (EDT)

Restored Unused Rooms
Here I will put the restored rooms of The Wind Waker. After the room "A_R00" partially restored thanks to Cuber456. Here are the rooms "TF_03" with the first room from "TF_05" which is identical.

TF_03DL

To add rooms in ISO of The Wind Waker, you must use GCR v1.0, then extract all files. Then you must edit the file "game.toc" with a hex editor. Add all the names of new files at the bottom. example:

TF_03DL.Room0.arc.Room1.arc.Room2.arc.Room3.arc.Room4.arc.Room5.arc.Room6.arc.Stage.arc.

Do not make one forget, otherwise it will not work.

Return GCR v1.0. Go to "Options" and "Do not use 'game.toc". This option allows you to exceed the limit of ISO. Then put all files into a new ISO.

Oh, a detail! You must create a new code to access this room! If you do not know how, let me know.

I hope I explained how, despite my problems with English. You can change my message to make it more readable.

--Dark Linkaël 06:37, 19 July 2012 (EDT)

What exactly makes this method different from, say, just taking the rooms of TF_03 and using GCR to graft them over the files of another area? TF_03 and TF_05 are not already in the .toc? I just do not understand what you are doing.

Also, you do not need to add stuff to the .toc to be able to add rooms. All you need is to make a folder and be sure to spell the name of it correctly when you edit an exit to make the game load the new folder.-Gamma 07:18, 19 July 2012 (EDT)

GCR adds files to the iso, but it is obligatory to change with a hex editor the file "game.toc" by adding the names of the files added in the iso. If you do not do that, the game does not detect new files and folders. Above all, you have to "Do not use 'game.toc" in GCR. A small error and it will not work.

For me, it works with my method and do not change "game.toc" it crashes the game.

It's complicated for me to really explain in another language.

--Dark Linkaël 12:44, 19 July 2012 (EDT)

Unused "Meet Tetra" Song
Seems there are still some secrets in TWW after all:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ZsjfMRkHMgM

This file is called "tetra_meet_b," and I have confirmed that it's not actually used in the Meet Tetra cutscene - though, it comes after a sequence called "tetra_meet," which IS used. I know the instruments sound odd, but since I don't know where the song was meant to be used, we can't put it in an area where the right instrument banks are loaded. Can I add it to the page? -Gamma 23:27, 15 September 2012 (EDT)

If you actually know for a fact that it is unused then just add it. The music sounds unused to me because I don't recall hearing it in the game. Secondly, how did you get a BMS file to play? I can get every other music file on the ISO to play but those. If I were you, I would replace/rename "tetra_meet_b.bms" to "tetra_meet.bms", rebuild the ISO and then see if you can get it to play in game during the Link meets Tetra cutscene. I don't know if it will work but I think it is worth screwing around with. --Cuber456 16:10, 16 September 2012 (EDT)

What I do is take the BMS I want to play and, using a hex editor, graft it over a BMS that I know I can get to play. The limitation of this, though, is that I can't graft a BMS over another that's smaller than it. This is the case for "tetra_meet.bms," unfortunately. Also, just to clarify, .bms files are sequence files - similar to MIDI. -Gamma 16:18, 16 September 2012 (EDT)

Bokoblin Behavior
Heh. I should have added this when I added the song:

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=XZfp88q5Mhw

In the Forest of Fairies, there are actually three bokoblin actors present - but only one, the one that you normally encounter near the first tree stump, loads. This is because the other two have weird parameters that makes them do... well, what they do in the video. To get these two to appear, you need to change the third bokoblin's parameters to that of the other two. It looks like they were meant to be trying to get Tetra to fall to them, or snap her up in their jaws. -Gamma 23:33, 15 September 2012 (EDT)

This behavior can be seen by activating the cutscene to make them spawn, then leaving and re-entering the map. -Abahbob

Early Gohma Texture
Gohma has two models - One with its armor/mask on, and one with it off. The textures for the model with no armor/mask contain an earlier version of the armor/mask texture, which is actually more detailed than the final:



Compared to the final:



I'll have to watch the E3 footage of Gohma to see if she uses this early texture. -Gamma 07:55, 20 September 2012 (EDT)

Interactive Multi-Game Demo Disc Version 9
This disk has a demo of TWW. This predates the collector's edition and has some text differences. I'm not sure if there are any other differences, besides less maps. Why is there no talk of it on here? -Abahbob

There has been some talk about it on the forums but it seems that not enough people are compelled to look though it for just some text differences. According to G4, the "release date" of that demo disk was Feb 15, 2003. At that time, the game was already released in Japan on December 13, 2002. Given this time frame, the main game was already completed. From this we can assume that the majority of the differences from the Japanese release to this demo disk and to the US release would be in the text. So for me personally, it is more of a sampling demo than a prototype. I'm not saying it isn't interesting but I think its more fun to dive into the unused rooms in the final version. I actually have the demo ISO but I can't seem to get it to play in Dolphin which sucks. I'd rather play through some of the different text than just straight up read it.

--Cuber456 19:36, 29 September 2012 (EDT)

I figured it was something like this. I managed to get a copy of the ISO, extract the TWW ISO from it, then extract the files from that. Sadly, it doesn't like to be recompiled and won't load. Playing through the normally available levels doesn't offer much, I am more interested in exploring the sea. I dumped all the text and picked out all the English text I could see, which can be seen at http://pastebin.com/ZixdpKVf. If I manage to get the recompiled iso to play, then hopefully I will have something to talk about. -Abahbob


 * Full script dump at, a (very) few notes at , probably more random mentions of the demo and what it contains in that thread... Hope that helps somehow? --Xdaniel 21:11, 29 September 2012 (EDT)

I managed to get to the sea by editing the Forsaken Fortress 1 exits, instead of going to majroom, going to sea room2. The game doesn't display any of the Japanese text, the boxes are just blank. Only half interesting thing I've noticed is that the intro to Greatfish Isle says Great Fish Island. Probably just a name change to make it sound better. The more I play through this, the more of a status update on translating the game it seems. Trying to go to any map that doesn't exit just restarts the game. I think I've looked into this enough. -Abahbob


 * Looking at this discussion, I'm pretty sure the Wind Waker demo on the Version 9 Demo Disc could be classified as a prototype of the American version, which was released just over a month later (March 24, 2003). While the game was finished, there were changes made between Japan and America/Europe, and the demo may or may not have them. Regardless, there's clearly differences in text between the demo and final, so I think they should be noted. -WarioBarker 21:45, 7 October 2012 (EDT)

None of the changes can be seen in the demo because those maps are not there. The only ones are: M_Dra09, M_DragB, M_NewD2, majroom, MajyuE, Mjtower, Name, sea, and sea_T. The changes currently on tcrf are in LinkUG and Hyrule. The only notable differences I am aware of are text size, the name of "Greatfish Island" was "Great Fish Island", and text differences. Actually, now that I think about it, there are some differences in chest locations that are not on tcrf between the U and J versions. These occur in sea. This is mainly to compensate for the change in the triforce shard quest that Nintendo changed to make the game easier iirc. I don't have a specific link to where they talked about it. -Abahbob, 8 October 2012


 * Regarding the maps, I didn't know that. Still, I think what changes are present between demo and US final should be noted, since it's at the very least a work-in-progress as far as translation goes. -WarioBarker 06:43, 10 October 2012 (EDT)

Another interesting thing I found, regarding the differences in the maps names shown. http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f318/abahbob/pn_13bti.png and http://i50.photobucket.com/albums/f318/abahbob/pn_08bti.jpg (Obviously Hyrule). I am not sure if you are able to get to the "Fairy Atoll" on the game, but I know that Hyrule is unreachable because of lack of maps. I got these images from \res\placename. EDIT: I found out that "Fairy Atoll" is actually in the USA files too. I'll look into it more. -Abahbob

Nice find! Looking at all the place names, there are a couple of oddities. For one, Greatfish Isle is once again referred to as Greatfish Island. The usage of Isle must have been a last-second decision by translators, which didn't get transferred to the image. Also, unlike the other dungeon names, the Tower of the Gods appears twice. The two images are slightly different - mainly in the curve of the two wind symbols that flank the text. The interesting thing is WHERE the two images appear. There's pn_16 which is between the Earth Temple and the Forbidden Woods, and then there's pn_07, which sits between Windfall Island and the "Kingdom of Hyrule" image. Since one is with the dungeon names and the other is with locations, could there have once been an island for the Tower of the Gods...? -Gamma 23:32, 12 December 2012 (EST)

Well, typically those texts appear when you first get to an island. I was thinking that the text would appear when you first make Tower of the Gods appear. I checked the Japanese version, and it does not show an image at that time. It is entirely possible that it was going to be an island though. This may explain why with a silly fadeout glitch you spawn back to Tower of the Gods, regardless of whether or not it has appeared yet, though that seems unlikely. -Abahbob

I just looked over the place names, and I found something interesting - names of islands and other places have a slightly different style from the names of dungeons! Since the Tower of the Gods exists as both a location-styled and dungeon-styled image, it's safe to say that somehow the Tower of the Gods was supposed to be introduced as a location and not just a dungeon. Also, what do you mean by "fade-out glitch?" -Gamma 23:51, 12 December 2012 (EST)

There is some stupid glitch when you enter the Windfall Island quadrant that sometimes it fades out. Iirc, it would sometimes result in you being warped to the Tower of the Gods quadrant. It was originally thought to be because the game was loading the pirate ship, but I've found that it occurs much more often when you start superswimming there, and it has been happening in speedruns. -Abahbob

Interesting. The fade out could be the game loading actors... perhaps one of them is programmed to set Link's position as the TotG quadrant? That could mean the actor was on an island around the Tower of the Gods at some point... Probably not, but it's nice to think. -Gamma 23:57, 12 December 2012 (EST)

Gah, just remembered that it was the King of Red Lions who moves to Tower of the Gods, not Link. Sorry, going off of old memories. -Abahbob

Ganondorf
I want to mention something that the KATA_RM section brings up. While it is hard to do, it is possible to hit Ganondorf with your own arrows. What is slightly interesting is that, you can stun Ganondorf with regular arrows. Again, it is kind of hard to do because he either blocks or dodges most of them. However, you will see if you rapid fire a bunch of regular arrows, eventually one will hit him and he will be stunned as if he got hit by a light arrow. This also works on the final boss stage provided you hack the bow and arrow into your inventory. --Cuber456 12:59, 27 November 2012 (EST)
 * Someone should try again to battle him on that unused room with the mask for viewing enemies HP equipped on. I think this would be very interesting, since during normal gameplay as a final boss his health does decrease: does his HP freeze so that it doesn't drop under a certain value like with the final boss from Mother 3? Montas1992 14:07, 27 November 2012 (EST)

Tingle Tuner's client_ud
I was finally able to get a modified ISO to run, and when I used the Tingle Tuner, I discovered that client_ud is, in fact, a debug version of the Tuner client. However, it doesn't seem to be extensive; the only thing I've seen is the ability to read all of the text. Some of the text can trigger events on the Tingle tuner, though, like lowering the price of some items. There could be some more hidden features. Who knows. -Gamma 00:31, 13 January 2013 (EST)

Good job! You should use the debug Tingle Tuner to see if places on the Great Sea have different text from the final Tuner(Like GreatFish Isle). At the very least, it would be worth mentioning that this debug version of the Tuner exists on the ISO. --Cuber456 04:34, 13 January 2013 (EST)

JP Version : client.bin msg_LZ.bin

US Version : client_u.bin client_ud.bin msg_LZ.bin

EU Version : client_0.bin client_0d.bin client_1.bin client_1d.bin client_2.bin client_2d.bin client_3.bin client_3d.bin client_4.bin client_4d.bin msg_LZ0.bin msg_LZ1.bin msg_LZ2.bin msg_LZ3.bin msg_LZ4.bin --Dark Linkaël 05:43, 13 January 2013 (EST)
 * Good to know that file command I ran led to something nice like this :) I still don't know about the mesg_LZ*.bin files, as IDA couldn't find any reference to the filename string being used (it only detected the string as being a string and marked it as such). Someone who knows about PowerPC assembly will need to look into the DOL (I have the US version converted to ELF and loaded into IDA 6.1 if anyone else wants it) to see... - Andlabs 01:05, 15 January 2013 (EST)

Possible Explanation for why Room19 has No Actors and a Warp to the Final Boss Room
While I was mulling over Room19, it suddenly came to me that there may be a reason as to why Room19 is so peculiar property-wise. Here's my suggestion:

''The reason for this exit existing, as well as the lack of objects, has a possible explanation when one looks at the position of Room18, the outdoor hall just before the Tower's final boss room, and Room19. Room18's access to the boss room juts into Room19 while the doors in both maps are otherwise lined up perfectly. It could be that during the Tower's refurbishment, the hard-coded exit to Gohdan's room in the dungeon's global actor file hadn't been implemented yet. Instead, the developers set the floor collision near the entrance of Room19 to start a warp, and set that warp to the final's boss room. Thus, when the player would open the boss door and Link would go inside, Room19 would be loaded, and the warp to the boss room would be triggered. Since Room18 has that jut into Room19, the player would never see Room19. In the event that this is true, it is very likely that this room's actors were nixed in order to prevent anything (events or otherwise) from interfering with Room19's new passive purpose as a redirect.''

My only source on this is a picture of the jut from Room18 into Room19. Is this too unfounded to add to the wiki? -Gamma 22:41, 23 January 2013 (EST)

Oh, I see what you mean. Seeing that you have evidence, I'd put it on. I always wondered why getting close to the door warped Link to the final boss room... I always thought that meant that the developers were simply acknowledging Room19's obsolete status and "redirecting" towards the final version. WhoIAm 11:03, 24 January 2013 (EST)

Alright. I'll put it up, and if anyone objects, it's easy to take down. Thanks. -Gamma 14:38, 24 January 2013 (EST)

Pirate Ship Rudder
File:Zelda WW Pirateship rudder fullview.png

So, after screwing around in Dolphin with the unrestricted camera feature, I noticed something interesting: the Pirate ship's model goes quite a bit beyond what you see in-game. I think this is worth adding to the page, isn't it?

(Sorry if the formatting's off-this is my first post. Long time lurker, though. :)--Robotortoise 18:10, 14 April 2013 (EDT)


 * Formatting is fine, but as for this, it's not technically "unused content" or something that was "cut" from the game. This more of a hidden thing that probably shouldn't be added to the page. Very neat though, you've made me wish I didn't sell my Gamecube all those years ago. 404 User Not Found 22:01, 14 April 2013 (EDT)


 * Considering our article has a bit about Jabun's unseen tail that's hidden underwater, I think this is fine, too. It's technically used, but never seen by the players, so it counts as relevant content, in my books.
 * --GlitterBerri 22:41, 14 April 2013 (EDT)

Allright. I'll add it posthaste. Thanks. --Robotortoise 21:45, 14 April 2013 (EDT)


 * I really don't want to be the one who starts a huge back-and-forth about whether or not "things that are hidden underwater" count as "unused" or "cut" content. If it's technically used, then it can't be unused. So I'll say this much. I think the Ship Rudder bit, and Jabun's unseen tail (as well as anything else detailing hidden things similar to the two examples I listed) should be removed from the article. However, I'm more suited to things relating to Team Fortress 2 and any Source engine games, so I'll leave this up to the admins (if any of you admins want to pipe in about this). Again, not trying to make a "thing" out of this, but my personal opinion on it is that it's not unused, so it doesn't belong on the article. 404 User Not Found 23:34, 14 April 2013 (EDT)


 * Personally, I think that there should be another category for things like this, Jabun's tail, and the pier in Super Mario Sunshine. Something along the lines of " Games with unseen content". These objects are in the grey area of TCRF as they are used, but unused at the same time. Einstein95 23:44, 14 April 2013 (EDT)


 * Personally, regardless of whether they're unused or not, they're certainly unnoticed, and can be regarded as an Oddity, which is a welcome type of content on this wiki last I checked. I recall that the purpose behind a resource like TCRF is to document all the interesting features found within our favorite games that not everyone may be aware of. The key part of that is content WITHIN. That ought include content like this ship rudder, Jabun's tail, the Gargoyle transformation in the Castlevania: Symphony of the Night article, and other similar submissions. That's my opinion as a follower, small contributor, and fan of TCRF for the past two or three years running.--Celice 04:27, 15 April 2013 (EDT)


 * I think the most effective criteria is "can you see it during normal gameplay?", and in this case, the answer is no. Post away. WhoIAm 12:00, 15 April 2013 (EDT)


 * Well I've seen other Legend of Zelda articles with info from map editors showing hidden switches and such, as well as info about other things of the sort. I just brought this up because I've seen this same type of stuff removed from articles in the past with the explanation "not unused". As for "can you see it during normal gameplay" being "effective criteria", it's not effective criteria. What does the main page of this wiki say?
 * '''"The Cutting Room Floor is a site dedicated to unearthing and researching unused and cut content from video games. From debug menus, to unused music, graphics, enemies, or levels, many games have content never meant to be seen by anybody but the developers — or even meant for everybody, but cut due to time/budget constraints.".
 * I don't see anything about "unearthing things that are in the game and can be viewed by using various cheat methods or world editors, and aren't technically unused or cut content, but hey, it can't be seen during normal gameplay so that's effective criteria" anywhere in that passage. And to beat everyone to the punch, I'm pretty sure "never meant to be seen by anybody but the developers" does not include stuff like this rudder. 404: User Not Found (talk) 14:02, 15 April 2013 (EDT)


 * Just as reference: http://tcrf.net/The_Cutting_Room_Floor:About 4(2) validates this rutter as being worth adding to the wiki. If you're going to dogmatically adhere to text out of context (that main page is more of marketing than describing the actual content of the wiki, I'm sure), you must taken into account all descriptions of the wiki, even conflicting ones.--Celice 04:38, 16 April 2013 (EDT)

We have this for other pages too, most notably the SMW2 article. I see no reason why this shouldn't be in. -- Sheeza 16:03, 15 April 2013 (EDT)


 * I don't see why it wouldn't count as cut. I mean, we have Hyrule's castle wall in the article, for instance. Can you see it normally? No. Technically, is it unused? No. HOWEVER, it is interesting, and I'm sure that the modelers intended for it to be visible ::::::when they were modeling the ship and didn't count on it as being not visible, it just worked out that way.
 * And then if what about, for instance, the "partially not visible rooms" in Four Swords Adventures? Is it used? Yes. Is it visible? No.


 * See, this is why I think not visible content counts as unused.


 * Court is adjourned. Robotortoise 16:07, 15 April 2013 (EDT)
 * Aww, don't be so strict... As for "not normally visible" parts of the model being considered "unused" or not, that's not what matters much. At the end of the day, don't we all want our users to come out of here with their mouthes agape from discovering interesting stuff that was under their noses all the time? Just my honest opinion. {EspyoT} 18:06, 15 April 2013 (EDT)

On another note, I need to ask TCRF in general: why are the requirements for "unused" content so strict? This would be my go-to site for pre-release and unused information, but it's not, because it lacks pre-release screenshots, promotional material, etc. that differ from the final version as well. With a name like "The Cutting Room Floor", one would think that this site documents not just stuff left in the final game, but everything related to pre-release versions. Not a demand, just a suggestion. WhoIAm 16:20, 15 April 2013 (EDT)
 * My goal when I founded the original site was to document cold, hard proof of cut content in games. I was sick of seeing nothing but blurry screenshots, hoaxes, and scenes that turned out to be nothing but mockups. That philosophy carried over into the wiki, and that's just kinda been "the way things are" ever since.
 * I would still like to start up a separate section of this wiki dedicated to prerelease materials, as I realize that they are worth preserving, it's just been repeatedly put on the back burner... --BMF54123 16:28, 15 April 2013 (EDT)
 * Good to hear from you on this, BMF :) As well, just realizing that I may have came off sounding like a dick in my last statement, that was not my intention. The same thing happened with information about the "Commander" class idea that was tossed around in the early development of Team Fortress 2. That information was removed from the article as it didn't count as "cut" content, mainly because there's nothing about it in the game files. And we do have information on pre-release versions, WhoIAm. Those articles are labelled with the "Proto:" prefix. Still, I do agree with comments made about requirements for unused content being strict. 404: User Not Found (talk) 16:34, 15 April 2013 (EDT)
 * Thank you both for your sensible comments :D I perfectly understand your wariness of dodgy beta material, I'm just referring to screens and promo material that clearly is legit (like from a magazine's preview interview with the developers, and many of those exist). I'm aware of the protos as well, that's part of what I meant. WhoIAm 16:44, 15 April 2013 (EDT)


 * "And then if what about, for instance, the "partially not visible rooms" in Four Swords Adventures? Is it used? Yes. Is it visible? No. See, this is why I think not visible content counts as unused." – to further clarify, the fact it isn't visible in normal gameplay means that the player would consider it unused. The game loads it, but the player can't see it outside of cheat devices, glitching, etc.
 * Another "interesting" thing that this Wiki covers are things that can be done in normal gameplay, but the player isn't given any hints or prompts to do some strange thing or another (or the hints/prompts are themselves unused) – usually things that don't affect the story. Alternately, it could be an event or line of dialogue that requires backtracking at a point where you actually can't do so, etc. -WarioBarker 23:37, 15 April 2013 (EDT)


 * Map select isn't working for me on console for some reason? What type of code is it? --8SomaCruzes 15:29, 3 June 2013 (EDT)

How to Import .dzb Files into Sketchup?
I saw several imports of DZB files into Sketchup (for example). What tool was used to make them? --Jimbo1qaz


 * First off, please put a signature so we know who is saying what because now I have to put it in for you...... I have only seen one DZB file imported into Google SketchUp and that was for the the collision of the room A_R00. I used that specific SketchUp file to recreate a BDL model for A_R00. I'm not sure on the specific details as how it was converted from a DZB file into a Google SketchUp file but from what I understand it was created by writing a program to convert it into graphics data that the N64 could recognize, then another program was written to convert that into an OBJ model. From there, it is easy to try to import it into Google SketchUp. Some details can be found here. As far as I can tell(although I haven't checked recently) there are no programs on the internet that can export a DZB model to Google SketchUp. That was why people had to create their own programs to convert the DZB file. If you talk to the person who started the thread in the link I posted, you might be able to get the program they used to convert the DZB file. --Cuber456 02:05, 27 June 2013 (EDT)
 * That's not true????? There was this one screenshot of the DZB walls surrounding the exit of Hyrule Castle, loaded into SKP, which means there's some way of getting DZBs into Sketchup. --Jimbo1qaz 13:47, 28 June 2013 (EDT)
 * Can you be more specific about what screenshot you are talking about and provide a link to it instead of just talking about it? Unless you specify what screenshots, I assume you are talking about these screenshots. Those aren't loaded into SketchUp. Those are screenshots of a program called Wind Viewer which is a program that lets you view WW and TP files. It can't, however, edit DZB files and can't export them to Google SketchUp. I never said that there wasn't a way to get a DZB file into Google SketchUp, its just that there aren't any programs, to my knowledge, floating around on the internet that simply allow you to export a DZB to a SketchUp file. It has been a year since I have really checked so a program could exist. Just go to Google and search around and see what pops up. The best I could find in a 5 min search was this. --Cuber456 14:43, 28 June 2013 (EDT)
 * Ok... . --Jimbo1qaz 11:47, 29 June 2013 (EDT)
 * I didn't bother actually reading the article... so ya I can take some blame there but like I said, last time I really cared to check on editing/exporting DZB files was a year ago. That last link was published on January 02, 2013 so there you go. What I can say is that Google is your best friend :P ! From my experience, try Googling the hell out of a topic before asking questions on a forum (or in this case, a wiki). It can be quicker than waiting for a response. If you can use the dzbTools listed in that link then you shouldn't have trouble exporting a DZB file into SketchUp. If you still have questions though, feel free to ask :). --Cuber456 21:36, 29 June 2013 (EDT)

Three unused object types - ambient lighting, lighting, and fog
Would it be possible to get some media showing off these unused effects? The article seems to imply that they are exclusive to cutscenes, and not able to be used in normal gameplay--regardless of the context, I think it would be quite nice if we can get a visual representation of these unused assets, if at all possible. --Celice (talk) 04:31, 30 November 2013 (EST)
 * Unfortunately, the effects were dummied out. We can't use them. -Gamma (talk) 22:16, 6 December 2013 (EST)

Unused Chart - Blue Chu Chart?!
I read this on zeldapendium.de: 'In The Wind Waker existiert eine besondere Schatzkarte, die die Fundorte der blauen Schleime anzeigt. Es war ursprünglich geplant, sie auf Events zu verteilen, da diese aber nicht stattfanden, kann sie nur durch den Eingriff eines Schummelsmoduls erhalten werden.' Translated: 'In The Wind Waker, there is a special treasure chart which shows the locations of the blue chu chus. It was originally planned to get the chart at events. The chart can be obtained only through the use of a cheat device.' What do you think? Is that true? GermanPokemon (talk) 13:40, 16 January 2014 (EST)
 * Speaking for myself, I'm not sure. Considering that the blue chus are rare, this certainly has plausibility of being true. I can't confirm it though. Hopefully someone else will check this out and confirm or deny this. --Cuber456 (talk) 16:34, 16 January 2014 (EST)

Crash Handler
A long time ago i opened the door in the test map on a real game cube. The screen went black and a crash handler appeared and showed me a .cpp file with a stacktrace. Today I tried the same thing on dolphin Emulator but it didnt work! I know that it was a PAL game. Currently I only have a NTSC version on my computer and I dont own the gamecube anymore. Can somebody test it? --Danbru1211 (talk)